Author Topic: Obsession, compulsion and simple need.  (Read 408 times)

Dave

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Obsession, compulsion and simple need.
« on: March 01, 2018, 08:16:43 AM »
Putting this here because "Philosophy" is close to "Psychology" very often. And we don't have a psychology slot . . .

After Recusant's post on the begining of language I had a sort of, "Aha!" moment, a possible insight. The importance of communication to me. Oh, I have "known" it for all my thinking life, just that familiarity breeds "unthinking acceptance" instead of contempt at times. Although, now I check the definitions of "contempt" I find "disregard for something that should be considered" so a less common usage of the word does actually fit!

And that is, though not originally intended to be, an example of the purpose of this post - communication and, more importantly, accurate and full communication.ooopoo788pipo8o78oo

It would not be unusual for such as I to be a little compulsive-obsessive - though I seem to break a commonly held rule in being compulsively and obsessively untidy! I like things to be "organised", let's say specific tool boxes for specific tasks (even to tool duplication, I have five pairs of pliers for pppppppppexample!) But that tool box may lay where I last used it for a  long time after that use, it is safe and secure and n9ot in my way . . . I have "habitual" ways of doing things but happily, and often deliberately, break those habits.99p88o86ooooo

But there is one common thread that has caused me problems in relationships and both paid and voluntary work all my life - o. Or perhaps a feeling of a need, an obsession, with having to know every fact and nuance about a situation. OK, I can appreciate the, "Please just accept/take it as read," type situation where that is necessary in terms of things like official/commercial secrets or personal information etc.

So, I fell out with my condultant because he too often simply ignored my questions or patronised me, takes ages to train a GP to give one all the televant information to make educated decisions . . And even in voluntary work I have ended up doing unecessary things because the other put emphasis on them - but meant the opposite to what I "heard". So, not always sure whose fault it is . . .

Perhaps spending nearly 12 years in the RAF did not help, there one is trained in communicating things if one is getting any kind of command rank, corporal upwards. Also in how to report things - completeness and accuracy are often essential in saving lives.

So, I tend to prefer self-generated projects, but that excludes others usually and team type voluntary work is a large part of my social life - providing they communicate!

This has really been "thinking aloud" but I would welcome comment or shared experience.



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xSilverPhinx

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Re: Obsession, compulsion and simple need.
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2018, 04:41:15 PM »
...Or perhaps a feeling of a need, an obsession, with having to know every fact and nuance about a situation.

I'm very much the same way, but I know that it's because I like to feel like I'm in control of my life and situations, even though that is an illusion. It's still an illusion I would rather have.
I'm just a student of the game that they taught me.


Dave

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Re: Obsession, compulsion and simple need.
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2018, 06:12:30 PM »
...Or perhaps a feeling of a need, an obsession, with having to know every fact and nuance about a situation.

I'm very much the same way, but I know that it's because I like to feel like I'm in control of my life and situations, even though that is an illusion. It's still an illusion I would rather have.

Ah, careful of control freakery there, Silver.

A friend's daughter is a control freak, so we have learned how to allow her the illusion 99% of the time by giving her a limited set of choices of our choosing.   :devil2:

She gets to choose eating places and things like that - my friend and I are happy to eat anywhere! Well, anywhere that has a licence to serve wine or allows BYO anyway!
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xSilverPhinx

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Re: Obsession, compulsion and simple need.
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2018, 11:39:02 PM »
...Or perhaps a feeling of a need, an obsession, with having to know every fact and nuance about a situation.

I'm very much the same way, but I know that it's because I like to feel like I'm in control of my life and situations, even though that is an illusion. It's still an illusion I would rather have.

Ah, careful of control freakery there, Silver.

A friend's daughter is a control freak, so we have learned how to allow her the illusion 99% of the time by giving her a limited set of choices of our choosing.   :devil2:

She gets to choose eating places and things like that - my friend and I are happy to eat anywhere! Well, anywhere that has a licence to serve wine or allows BYO anyway!

:lol: I wouldn't call myself a control freak, I like to plan things out down to the minute details, but am well aware that you don't control people who don't want to be controlled or anything like that. At best I can control certain variables in the environment which will heighten the odds of me getting what I want out of a situation.

For instance, I am afraid of getting lost so if going somewhere I've never been before I will look the streets up using Google Maps and  memorise the landmarks (at home, because whipping out your cellphone on the streets is just asking to be mugged). I will see which buses go where beforehand (once again, because publicly showing you have a cellphone just isn't very smart) . I will plan itineraries when traveling (which I never really stick to but like I said, I like to feel like I'm in control of something). I can deal with unpleasant surprises well but I don't like them. 

My sister is a control freak, and likes to micro-manage people. A certain someone who has just recently left the lab too. I hate being micro-managed by people I see are no wiser than I, telling me what I ought and ought not to do. How can someone who seems to have a lot of trouble learning from their own mistakes think they should impart their 'wisdom' onto others? ::) Anyway I'm just rambling. Generally I take the same approach you and your friend do when dealing with people control freaks, I let them think that I will do what they want...but generally do my own thing instead. 
I'm just a student of the game that they taught me.


Dave

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Re: Obsession, compulsion and simple need.
« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2018, 06:50:01 AM »
OK, planning is good, also covering as many problem points as possible. I download and print Google maps and "take a tour" on Street View, usually printing anmotated screen shots of critical junctions or lsnd marks as seen ftom the driver's seat.

I dtill get lost.

 :shrug:

Later: I forgot to add, Silver, that is a sad indictment of your country and culture if you cannot safely use a smartphone in public. Some of us complain about occasional violence and crime in our societies not understanding the everyday violence in many other, often more deeply religious, societies.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2018, 07:25:52 AM by Dave »
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xSilverPhinx

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Re: Obsession, compulsion and simple need.
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2018, 01:47:19 PM »
OK, planning is good, also covering as many problem points as possible. I download and print Google maps and "take a tour" on Street View, usually printing anmotated screen shots of critical junctions or lsnd marks as seen ftom the driver's seat.

I dtill get lost.

 :shrug:

:lol:

<--- The hippocampus plays an important role in spacial memory. There was even a famous study done showing that the hippocampi of British taxi drivers that passed 'The Knowldege' taxi test were enlarged compared to the average population. I would definitely fail that test!

I get lost too, and when I do I just drive a bit until I find myself again. :P     


Quote
Later: I forgot to add, Silver, that is a sad indictment of your country and culture if you cannot safely use a smartphone in public. Some of us complain about occasional violence and crime in our societies not understanding the everyday violence in many other, often more deeply religious, societies.

Yeah, things are getting tough here. In the last 10 years violence has gone through the roof. In Rio de Janeiro, during this year's Carnival things got so bad that the faux president put the army on the streets and employed a general to oversee all security operations -- intelligence gathering, patrolling, arrests, etc. 

The police force is a joke. A weak, underpaid, corrupt institution. 

To me, it looks a little like what the Ancient Romans did when barbarians became too much of a problem.  ::) Institute a temporary dictator to solve the problem. Except I have my doubts as to whether this tactic will work here.
I'm just a student of the game that they taught me.


Dave

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Re: Obsession, compulsion and simple need.
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2018, 02:12:22 PM »
OK, planning is good, also covering as many problem points as possible. I download and print Google maps and "take a tour" on Street View, usually printing anmotated screen shots of critical junctions or lsnd marks as seen ftom the driver's seat.

I dtill get lost.

 :shrug:

:lol:

<--- The hippocampus plays an important role in spacial memory. There was even a famous study done showing that the hippocampi of British taxi drivers that passed 'The Knowldege' taxi test were enlarged compared to the average population. I would definitely fail that test!

I get lost too, and when I do I just drive a bit until I find myself again. :P     


Quote
Later: I forgot to add, Silver, that is a sad indictment of your country and culture if you cannot safely use a smartphone in public. Some of us complain about occasional violence and crime in our societies not understanding the everyday violence in many other, often more deeply religious, societies.

Yeah, things are getting tough here. In the last 10 years violence has gone through the roof. In Rio de Janeiro, during this year's Carnival things got so bad that the faux president put the army on the streets and employed a general to oversee all security operations -- intelligence gathering, patrolling, arrests, etc. 

The police force is a joke. A weak, underpaid, corrupt institution. 

To me, it looks a little like what the Ancient Romans did when barbarians became too much of a problem.  ::) Institute a temporary dictator to solve the problem. Except I have my doubts as to whether this tactic will work here.

I seem OK in terms of where I, and everything else, is/am in 3D space, very good proprioception etc. Driving I sometimes have to "play a video" of the route in my mind to be sure of the correct turnings - but that only works for routes that I have driven before. New routes I cannot hold from a screen or paper image, need to constantly referrence that image. Satnav is a boon, but even that gets things wrong!

I remember the taxi driver study but also that it invoked the same question as asked about old Albert's enhanced links between the visualisation bits of his brain and data/maths processing. Chicken or egg, are taxi drivers and geniuses born that way or do they have a propensity towards certain things and dedicated work over-develops the brain bits in a certain way?

Guessing the difference is not that big percentage-wise but how about organisation-wise? More wiring or better designed?
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xSilverPhinx

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Re: Obsession, compulsion and simple need.
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2018, 02:29:47 PM »
I remember the taxi driver study but also that it invoked the same question as asked about old Albert's enhanced links between the visualisation bits of his brain and data/maths processing. Chicken or egg, are taxi drivers and geniuses born that way or do they have a propensity towards certain things and dedicated work over-develops the brain bits in a certain way?

Guessing the difference is not that big percentage-wise but how about organisation-wise? More wiring or better designed?

That's a good question! I don't remember if they scanned their hippocampi before they underwent the training process as well. I shall have to read the paper again. It is very possible that those who pass The Knowledge test already have more propensity to develop that expertise. There are differences between males and females (males generally do better) and it isn't too much of a stretch to think that even amongst those of the same gender there are differences as well. Certain neurological disorders such as epilepsy cause a lot of damage to the hippocampus, stress too (cortisol, the stress hormone, kills hippocampal cells).   

Exercise and 'enriched', intellectually stimulating environments tend to favour a better hippocampus.

It would be very difficult to control for all these variables when performing studies with human subjects, and therefore difficult to answer egg-or-chicken questions.  :shrug: 
I'm just a student of the game that they taught me.