Author Topic: virtuous  (Read 1406 times)

AngelOfDeath

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virtuous
« on: December 09, 2017, 12:07:23 AM »
I found out there's an internet group
« Last Edit: December 21, 2017, 05:28:15 PM by AngelOfDeath »

Sandra Craft

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2017, 02:16:16 AM »
I congratulate them on taking one for the team.
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Dave

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2017, 08:19:37 AM »
One supposes it is a bit like being an alvoholic, they are never "cured" of the urge but have chosen to control it. Not happy with "virtuous" but I can see their intent.

Yes, this kind of self-control is to be applauded. Especially if they work towards helping victims indirectly, or counsel others.
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Tank

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2017, 09:14:00 AM »
I found out there's an internet group called virtuous pedophiles made up of people who profess to be pedophiles but have pledged (is pledged the right word?)...anyway, they've "pledged" to not molest or have sexual contact with children.  What is everyone's opinion of this group of people and their group in general?

This is a development that should be applauded at every level. The problem is that the term paedophile is used indiscriminately and interchangeably with child molester.  As a result no paedophile is going to be able to admit their sexual orientation for fear of retribution. Thus they have no support structure to help them not cross the line to child molester.

We spend a lot of time and money tracking down child molesters. It would be a good thing to invest in support systems for paedophiles to reduce the occurrences of child molestation. And the huge advantage of spending the money on prevention rather than capture post event is there is no victim!

Paedophiles are vilified in society at the moment. What we need to do is praise and support these 'virtuous paedophiles' thus we have both carrot and stick. We will have both mechanisms of behavioural modification in action rather than just one. That has to be a good thing.
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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2017, 09:40:02 AM »
If I were one, I'd keep very quiet - even though their decision is indeed most praiseworthy.

Tank

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2017, 09:46:32 AM »
If I were one, I'd keep very quiet - even though their decision is indeed most praiseworthy.
I agree. And this is the problem that society faces. No paedophile could go to say their doctor and openly discuss this issue. Thus when faced with a terrible dilemma of an urge that it is rightly illegal to satisfy they have nobody to turn to. Not even a spouse unless they marry against their natural tendencies.
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
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Dave

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2017, 10:18:55 AM »
If I were one, I'd keep very quiet - even though their decision is indeed most praiseworthy.
I agree. And this is the problem that society faces. No paedophile could go to say their doctor and openly discuss this issue. Thus when faced with a terrible dilemma of an urge that it is rightly illegal to satisfy they have nobody to turn to. Not even a spouse unless they marry against their natural tendencies.

Bit OT, Tank, but could you expand on that last sentence? It seems to imply that paedophillia is like homosexuality, that it excludes all kinds of attraction, emotional as well as sexual, to other than one specific group, in this case children. I am unsure if that is the case.

Not the same thing but "pornophillia" is becoming a common phrase and afflicts married men as well as single. Both are "deviances" from commonly accepted behaviour but can they not both exist in parallel?
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Tank

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2017, 11:18:18 AM »
If I were one, I'd keep very quiet - even though their decision is indeed most praiseworthy.
I agree. And this is the problem that society faces. No paedophile could go to say their doctor and openly discuss this issue. Thus when faced with a terrible dilemma of an urge that it is rightly illegal to satisfy they have nobody to turn to. Not even a spouse unless they marry against their natural tendencies.

Bit OT, Tank, but could you expand on that last sentence? It seems to imply that paedophillia is like homosexuality, that it excludes all kinds of attraction, emotional as well as sexual, to other than one specific group, in this case children. I am unsure if that is the case.

Not the same thing but "pornophillia" is becoming a common phrase and afflicts married men as well as single. Both are "deviances" from commonly accepted behaviour but can they not both exist in parallel?

Take two continuums, one related to attraction by age the other to gender. Put them on a chart. Age vertical, low to high. Gender attraction horizontal, homosexual to heterosexual. Place yourself on the two scales. That would be your age/gender placement. Draw a horizontal line at say 16 (age of consent in the UK). Whatever your gender alignment if you fall below that line and act on your drives you will be committing a crime. The majority of people will be above the line and to the right of the chart. You can go horizontally wherever you like and as long as you above the line you're ok. It's people who's sexual attractions are below the line that are potentially dangerous and need all the upfront help we can give them to prevent them from acting on their attractions.

Does that help?
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
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Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.

Dave

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #8 on: December 09, 2017, 11:32:25 AM »
If I were one, I'd keep very quiet - even though their decision is indeed most praiseworthy.
I agree. And this is the problem that society faces. No paedophile could go to say their doctor and openly discuss this issue. Thus when faced with a terrible dilemma of an urge that it is rightly illegal to satisfy they have nobody to turn to. Not even a spouse unless they marry against their natural tendencies.

Bit OT, Tank, but could you expand on that last sentence? It seems to imply that paedophillia is like homosexuality, that it excludes all kinds of attraction, emotional as well as sexual, to other than one specific group, in this case children. I am unsure if that is the case.

Not the same thing but "pornophillia" is becoming a common phrase and afflicts married men as well as single. Both are "deviances" from commonly accepted behaviour but can they not both exist in parallel?

Take two continuums, one related to attraction by age the other to gender. Put them on a chart. Age vertical, low to high. Gender attraction horizontal, homosexual to heterosexual. Place yourself on the two scales. That would be your age/gender placement. Draw a horizontal line at say 16 (age of consent in the UK). Whatever your gender alignment if you fall below that line and act on your drives you will be committing a crime. The majority of people will be above the line and to the right of the chart. You can go horizontally wherever you like and as long as you above the line you're ok. It's people who's sexual attractions are below the line that are potentially dangerous and need all the upfront help we can give them to prevent them from acting on their attractions.

Does that help?

Um, not exactly! Does not answer the question in my mind as to whether or not a person can be both have paedophillic tendencies yet also be emotionally and sexually attracted to an age peer at the same time. Heterosexually married men can also have homosexual tendencies or attractions, wonen ditto. Age "displacemrnt" is another matter but "attraction" of some form is a basic human faculty.

I agree that child sexual abuse, using a child for purely selfish sexual gratification, is entirely another matter. Mental illness needs special attention.

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Tank

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2017, 12:03:00 PM »
...Does not answer the question in my mind as to whether or not a person can be both have paedophillic tendencies yet also be emotionally and sexually attracted to an age peer at the same time. ..
Given the almost infinite variability of human behaviour it would not surprise me at all if there were people who are simply sexually attracted to others totally irrespective of that persons age or gender. In fact I would say that it's virtually certain that some people fall into this category.
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
“Religion is a culture of faith; science is a culture of doubt.” ― Richard P. Feynman
'It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die. That is true, it's called Life.' - Terry Pratchett
Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.

Bad Penny II

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2017, 01:05:41 PM »
If I were one, I'd keep very quiet - even though their decision is indeed most praiseworthy.
I agree. And this is the problem that society faces. No paedophile could go to say their doctor and openly discuss this issue. Thus when faced with a terrible dilemma of an urge that it is rightly illegal to satisfy they have nobody to turn to. Not even a spouse unless they marry against their natural tendencies.

Bit OT, Tank, but could you expand on that last sentence? It seems to imply that paedophillia is like homosexuality, that it excludes all kinds of attraction, emotional as well as sexual, to other than one specific group, in this case children. I am unsure if that is the case.

Not the same thing but "pornophillia" is becoming a common phrase and afflicts married men as well as single. Both are "deviances" from commonly accepted behaviour but can they not both exist in parallel?

Take two continuums, one related to attraction by age the other to gender. Put them on a chart. Age vertical, low to high. Gender attraction horizontal, homosexual to heterosexual. Place yourself on the two scales. That would be your age/gender placement. Draw a horizontal line at say 16 (age of consent in the UK). Whatever your gender alignment if you fall below that line and act on your drives you will be committing a crime. The majority of people will be above the line and to the right of the chart. You can go horizontally wherever you like and as long as you above the line you're ok. It's people who's sexual attractions are below the line that are potentially dangerous and need all the upfront help we can give them to prevent them from acting on their attractions.

Does that help?

Um, not exactly! Does not answer the question in my mind as to whether or not a person can be both have paedophillic tendencies yet also be emotionally and sexually attracted to an age peer at the same time.

Yes of course.
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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2017, 05:10:03 PM »
^^^ says Bad Penny II
 :lol:
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Bad Penny II

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2017, 05:37:44 PM »
^^^ says Bad Penny II
 :lol:

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« Last Edit: December 09, 2017, 05:51:54 PM by Bad Penny II »
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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #13 on: December 09, 2017, 07:51:48 PM »
I don't think I can trust them around children even if they have pledged never to molest one. That's difficult for me to do, even though a pedophile who does molest children and one who does not are in two different groups altogether.

However, like some of the above posters I applaud them for seeking whatever it is they are seeking from that group: support, community, etc. Even though they're wired to feel sexually attracted to children, they're still human.
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Tank

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Re: virtuous pedophiles?
« Reply #14 on: December 09, 2017, 08:00:52 PM »
I don't think I can trust them around children even if they have pledged never to molest one. That's difficult for me to do, even though a pedophile who does molest children and one who does not are in two different groups altogether.

However, like some of the above posters I applaud them for seeking whatever it is they are seeking from that group: support, community, etc. Even though they're wired to feel sexually attracted to children, they're still human.

I agree that they should not be put in a position of temptation. And I think that people who are honest about their attractions in this way would not want to be put in that position anyway. That would be part of the support offered, to deliberately train and seek employment in jobs where you specifically don't come into contact with children.
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
“Religion is a culture of faith; science is a culture of doubt.” ― Richard P. Feynman
'It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die. That is true, it's called Life.' - Terry Pratchett
Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.