Author Topic: America is a gun  (Read 1026 times)

Tanksinatra

  • I did it my wayyyyyy!!!!
  • Administrator
  • Excellent and Indefatigable Guardian of Reason
  • *****
  • Posts: 30452
  • Gender: Male
America is a gun
« on: October 04, 2017, 10:54:26 AM »
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
“Religion is a culture of faith; science is a culture of doubt.” ― Richard P. Feynman
'It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die. That is true, it's called Life.' - Terry Pratchett
Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.

No one

  • Not Defeated by the Dark Night of the Soul
  • ****
  • Posts: 1583
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2017, 01:09:13 PM »
Well shoot, I bet that Brian is a real pistol. Do you think he targeted America while riding the bullet train?

Bad Penny II

  • Yields Not to Kalamity
  • ****
  • Posts: 1134
  • Nice Borderline Troll
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2017, 02:03:47 PM »
Did anyone else benefit from the 3.5% rise in American Outdoor Brands Corporation (owner of Smith & Wesson (they make guns)).
Guns, beautiful guns, let me slide, oh no, no I'm saving myself for Agatha.
Certainty disturbs me


Ecurb Noselrub

  • No Wall in my name!!!
  • Wears a Colander Hat for Special Occasions
  • *****
  • Posts: 6333
  • Gender: Male
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2017, 09:42:22 PM »
From inside America, it does not seem like a gun to me. Las Vegas type events do happen, but that is not the predominant feature of the culture.  We've also had three major hurricanes here recently - doesn't mean that "America is a hurricane".  But maybe that's what it seems like from the outside to some, given the level of media attention that is given to these events.  If you are predisposed to criticizing the country I suppose this provides an opportunity.  But to say that "England is a cup of tea" and "America is a gun" seems a little overdone.  Just my opinion.

Dave

  • Formerly known as Gloucester
  • Don't Pray in My School, and I Won't Think in Your Church
  • *****
  • Posts: 7105
  • Gender: Male
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2017, 09:56:28 PM »
From inside America, it does not seem like a gun to me. Las Vegas type events do happen, but that is not the predominant feature of the culture.  We've also had three major hurricanes here recently - doesn't mean that "America is a hurricane".  But maybe that's what it seems like from the outside to some, given the level of media attention that is given to these events.  If you are predisposed to criticizing the country I suppose this provides an opportunity.  But to say that "England is a cup of tea" and "America is a gun" seems a little overdone.  Just my opinion.

I took it as being tongue in cheek and perhaps less than fully in good taste at the moment. Not that good taste gets much of a look in where the predominant attitude seems to be that offending others is considered a human right.
Tomorrow is precious, don't ruin it by fouling up today.
Passed Monday 10th Dec 2018 age 74

Icarus

  • The wise one.
  • Guardian of Reason
  • *****
  • Posts: 5249
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2017, 11:52:54 PM »
Rather extensive discussion on NPR today. It appears that the country music crowd is more inclined to support the NRA than other people with different tastes.  Not to indict the country music fan, just recounting the statistical evidence that was presented.  Interestingly the C&W fans and the NRA supporters are not at all concentrated in the backwoods south.  Who would have known that Wisconsin is a strong gun rights state.  On the other side of the coin, a large majority of all the NRA members do support some kind of gun control.

The Las Vegas maniac was an apparent good citizen who could and easily did qualify for gun ownership.  That he had at least 49 firearms, thousands of rounds of ammunition as well as some chemicals and fertilizers that are essential components of homespun explosive devices remains a mystery. I am a gun control guy but I am aware that no amount of legislation that is within reason would have prevented the perpetrator from collecting those guns and doing what he did.

For our not American members. NPR is National Public Radio, one of the less politically slanted media sources.  NRA is the National Rifle Association whose members are mostly rational but whose leaders are completely out of touch with reality.

xSilverPhinx

  • Non Dvcor
  • Administrator
  • Luxembourg Trembles!
  • *****
  • Posts: 14854
  • Gender: Female
  • Twinkle, twinkle little star
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2017, 01:13:37 AM »
From inside America, it does not seem like a gun to me. Las Vegas type events do happen, but that is not the predominant feature of the culture.  We've also had three major hurricanes here recently - doesn't mean that "America is a hurricane".  But maybe that's what it seems like from the outside to some, given the level of media attention that is given to these events.  If you are predisposed to criticizing the country I suppose this provides an opportunity.  But to say that "England is a cup of tea" and "America is a gun" seems a little overdone.  Just my opinion.

:notsure: Well, the US does spend a lot of money on defence and the military...

But yes, it's not like the US is a warzone or anything.

ETA: I was surprised how it seems the whole country has something like PTSD when I visited the States back in 2014. Hypervigilant and on edge.
Give no mercy to your fear.



Papasito Bruno

  • Deranged Psychopathic Twinkle Toes
  • Guardian of Reason
  • *****
  • Posts: 5197
  • Gender: Male
  • Save water. Shower together!
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2017, 01:53:27 AM »
Based on these figures I'd say the Tea and Gun comparison is spot on.

UK population: 65m
US population: 330m
UK gun homicides: ≈ 50-60/year
US gun homicides ≈ 11,500/year
5x the population
210x the gun murders.
I'm truly sorry, but I can't keep explaining this simple thing to you over and over again hoping that you'll finally understand something so simple and obvious.
I'm not the "Dumb-Ass Whisperer".

I really, really hate anti-semantics.

Recusant

  • Miscreant Erendrake
  • Administrator
  • Wears a Colander Hat for Special Occasions
  • *****
  • Posts: 6002
  • Gender: Male
  • infidel barbarian
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2017, 01:56:18 AM »
I was surprised how it seems the whole country has something like PTSD when I visited the States back in 2014. Hypervigilant and on edge.

I'm going to guess that you visited the east coast.
"Religion is fundamentally opposed to everything I hold in veneration — courage, clear thinking, honesty, fairness, and above all, love of the truth."
— H. L. Mencken


xSilverPhinx

  • Non Dvcor
  • Administrator
  • Luxembourg Trembles!
  • *****
  • Posts: 14854
  • Gender: Female
  • Twinkle, twinkle little star
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2017, 02:23:57 AM »
I was surprised how it seems the whole country has something like PTSD when I visited the States back in 2014. Hypervigilant and on edge.

I'm going to guess that you visited the east coast.

Yes, Manhattan. But I also spent some time in Las Vegas (midwest?) and felt that perhaps the people there had also been under 'red alert' a little too long. 

We landed in Las Vegas first and saw there were military personnel patrolling the airport. When we were waiting for our flight back to Brazil in the JFK airport there was what seemed to be an abandoned bag on the floor and two soldiers were quite frightened around it. People rushed past and we didn't stick around. The whole Boston marathon episode came to mind.

There were posters with "If you see something, say something" in a variety of public spaces, the underground metro, and buses. 
Give no mercy to your fear.



Dave

  • Formerly known as Gloucester
  • Don't Pray in My School, and I Won't Think in Your Church
  • *****
  • Posts: 7105
  • Gender: Male
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2017, 03:00:47 AM »
Rather extensive discussion on NPR today. It appears that the country music crowd is more inclined to support the NRA than other people with different tastes.  Not to indict the country music fan, just recounting the statistical evidence that was presented.  Interestingly the C&W fans and the NRA supporters are not at all concentrated in the backwoods south.  Who would have known that Wisconsin is a strong gun rights state.  On the other side of the coin, a large majority of all the NRA members do support some kind of gun control.

The Las Vegas maniac was an apparent good citizen who could and easily did qualify for gun ownership.  That he had at least 49 firearms, thousands of rounds of ammunition as well as some chemicals and fertilizers that are essential components of homespun explosive devices remains a mystery. I am a gun control guy but I am aware that no amount of legislation that is within reason would have prevented the perpetrator from collecting those guns and doing what he did.

For our not American members. NPR is National Public Radio, one of the less politically slanted media sources.  NRA is the National Rifle Association whose members are mostly rational but whose leaders are completely out of touch with reality.

I can see, but cannot adequately describe, the link between country music and the NRA. One might say that both are founded in a kind of semi mythical or legendary image. Both have a distorted view of that reslity and both try to live up to it. It is all part of the waking dream/nightmare world some Americans try to impose on the real world.

The distorted language the likes of Trump uses is part of the pattern. All politicians use rhetoric but the Trumps actually believe their own crap and try to make it reality. And all the other bozzos accept it into their empty minds.
Tomorrow is precious, don't ruin it by fouling up today.
Passed Monday 10th Dec 2018 age 74

Recusant

  • Miscreant Erendrake
  • Administrator
  • Wears a Colander Hat for Special Occasions
  • *****
  • Posts: 6002
  • Gender: Male
  • infidel barbarian
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2017, 04:56:39 AM »
I was surprised how it seems the whole country has something like PTSD when I visited the States back in 2014. Hypervigilant and on edge.

I'm going to guess that you visited the east coast.

Yes, Manhattan. But I also spent some time in Las Vegas (midwest?) and felt that perhaps the people there had also been under 'red alert' a little too long. 

We landed in Las Vegas first and saw there were military personnel patrolling the airport. When we were waiting for our flight back to Brazil in the JFK airport there was what seemed to be an abandoned bag on the floor and two soldiers were quite frightened around it. People rushed past and we didn't stick around. The whole Boston marathon episode came to mind.

There were posters with "If you see something, say something" in a variety of public spaces, the underground metro, and buses.

Airports in the US have been turned into centers of paranoia and suspicion in the US ever since 2001 (though to a large extent the same holds true for Europe--armed soldiers are a common sight in the big airports like Charles de Gaulle). The same for public transportation.

As for Las Vegas, it's a steaming pile of madness in the middle of the desert. It's very common on television in the UK for contestants of quiz shows, when asked what they would do with their winnings, to say, "take a trip to Las Vegas." I just shake my head in amazement.
"Religion is fundamentally opposed to everything I hold in veneration — courage, clear thinking, honesty, fairness, and above all, love of the truth."
— H. L. Mencken


Dave

  • Formerly known as Gloucester
  • Don't Pray in My School, and I Won't Think in Your Church
  • *****
  • Posts: 7105
  • Gender: Male
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2017, 07:02:17 AM »
You would not have got me anywhere near Las Vegas at any time. For any money. It was always my idea of Hell on Earth! But then, most "resorts" put me off. Noise, music, bright lights and masses of people? No thanks!
Tomorrow is precious, don't ruin it by fouling up today.
Passed Monday 10th Dec 2018 age 74

Dave

  • Formerly known as Gloucester
  • Don't Pray in My School, and I Won't Think in Your Church
  • *****
  • Posts: 7105
  • Gender: Male
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2017, 07:59:50 AM »
Based on these figures I'd say the Tea and Gun comparison is spot on.

UK population: 65m
US population: 330m
UK gun homicides: ≈ 50-60/year
US gun homicides ≈ 11,500/year
5x the population
210x the gun murders.


UK population is about 70m now but . . .



US intentional homicides: 15 700   UK intentional homicides: 600 (approx figures) ratio 26:1



Note: in Switzerland conscription and reserve military service are compulsory and all those trained retain their service weapon.

Sources
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-41488081
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

See also:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate#
« Last Edit: October 05, 2017, 08:47:13 AM by Dave »
Tomorrow is precious, don't ruin it by fouling up today.
Passed Monday 10th Dec 2018 age 74

Dave

  • Formerly known as Gloucester
  • Don't Pray in My School, and I Won't Think in Your Church
  • *****
  • Posts: 7105
  • Gender: Male
Re: America is a gun
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2017, 08:30:55 AM »
Re armed police and troops at airports: the UK suffered that during the IRA problems, think the police never went away.
Tomorrow is precious, don't ruin it by fouling up today.
Passed Monday 10th Dec 2018 age 74