Author Topic: Talking to myself . . .  (Read 12593 times)

Magdalena

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Re: Talking to myself . . .
« Reply #285 on: February 16, 2018, 02:19:25 AM »
No Mags, I'd recommend a coffee, followed by a good stiff whisky! :grin:
Fine!

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No one

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Re: Talking to myself . . .
« Reply #286 on: February 16, 2018, 04:48:06 AM »


Here you go raps.

Magdalena

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Re: Talking to myself . . .
« Reply #287 on: February 16, 2018, 06:45:41 AM »

Davin

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Re: Talking to myself . . .
« Reply #288 on: February 16, 2018, 02:14:53 PM »
You are, Mags, entitled to agree with anyone whose world view accords with your own. I'll just offer these as reference:

https://www.livestrong.com/article/75282-parents-effect-child-behavior/

https://my.vanderbilt.edu/developmentalpsychologyblog/2014/04/how-do-you-affect-your-child/
Parents affect their children's behavior? I think we can safely put that into the "no shit, Sherlock" bucket.

The question is how one affects them. Is going around blowing things out of proportion and calling silly things "child abuse" teaching your kids that it's OK to blow thing out of proportion and using terms inappropriately?

Quote from: Dave
That "amusing behaviour" you teach your toddler can become "that annoying behaviour" ten years later. Encouraging it 2 and punishing it at 12 can possibly confuse a kid and lead to emotional and/or behavioural problems. Excepting genetic problems, congenital conditions (not caused by the mother's habits), any kind of abuse by a non-family person (of which the parents are ignorant), and physical injury parents get the kids they raise, there is nothing and no-one else to praise or blame.
Are you trying to say that you had not choice in how you are behaving right now and that it is entirely the fault of your parents? Then the way they behaved is the result of their parents and they are not responsible for their actions. And all the way down the line no one is responsible for their own actions. Bullshit. People make their own choices and while parenting can influence children, each child is also an individuals who chooses how they act. That means that bad kids can come from good parents and good kids can come from bad parents. Both of which I have seen happen many times.

Quote from: Dave
I have no more to say on this.
That is probably better for you.

Always question all authorities because the authority you don't question is the most dangerous... except me, never question me.

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Re: Talking to myself . . .
« Reply #289 on: February 23, 2018, 12:40:43 AM »
Hmmm...I'd like to chime in even though I am not a developmental psychologist or anything. Take my thoughts with a grain of salt.

As far as behaviour goes, genes and environmental influences shouldn't be separated when it comes to learning. It's not nature or nurture it's almost always both to varying degrees depending on the behaviour and the individual. Besides genes and past experiences that may predispose us to certain behaviours, there are genes and past experiences which exert a protective effect as well. The complexities of learning should be considered, even if one really wants to reduce behaviour to "genes this" or "environment and parenting that". It's an orchestra of both.

Think of it as a baker making a cake, in which the cake is the individual, the ingredients are the genes and the environment are the baker's hands, making the finished product a certain way. If the baker isn't well that day the finished product can turn out a certain way, if there's an excess of an ingredient it will influence the outcome, etc. This analogy of course is extremely simplistic, as animals' brains are plastic to a degree and they and are constantly learning from incoming stimuli from the environment. No two cakes are ever the same, even two with the same amounts of ingredients (twins), because of the baker.

It seems to me that young children learn a lot from their parents, who are basically at the center of their world (OK, maybe young children see themselves at the center of their world ;D ) and as they grow into adolescence, peers gradually take precedence over parents. The pressure to "fit in" at that age can be overwhelming. Adolescents are naturally risk-takers, he frontal part of the brain, just behind the eyes, is not yet fully developed (this process takes longer in males). Evolutionary, it's a phase in which mammals start to come into their own and venture into the world. IMO, forbidding something makes it all the more attractive, but that's my point of view, not necessarily shared by others.  :-X

I don't believe giving a young child a bottle filled with a nonalcoholic beverage will result in them growing up to be alcoholics. That's akin to saying that playing violent video games will make a person violent. It just doesn't make sense and doesn't take into consideration just how complex learning can be.

Dave, you mentioned a sweet tooth being a learned behaviour. I think there's truth to that, people can become addicted to the stuff and it acts on the brain in similar ways to some illicit drugs. Kids' brains can even be 'pre-programmed' to like certain types of food before they are born. My sister, for instance, would crave salt when she was pregnant and now my niece wants to put salt on everything! :lol:     
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Magdalena

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Re: Talking to myself . . .
« Reply #290 on: February 23, 2018, 04:06:51 AM »
Hmmm...I'd like to chime in even though I am not a developmental psychologist or anything. Take my thoughts with a grain of salt.

As far as behaviour goes, genes and environmental influences shouldn't be separated when it comes to learning. It's not nature or nurture it's almost always both to varying degrees depending on the behaviour and the individual. Besides genes and past experiences that may predispose us to certain behaviours, there are genes and past experiences which exert a protective effect as well. The complexities of learning should be considered, even if one really wants to reduce behaviour to "genes this" or "environment and parenting that". It's an orchestra of both.

Think of it as a baker making a cake, in which the cake is the individual, the ingredients are the genes and the environment are the baker's hands, making the finished product a certain way. If the baker isn't well that day the finished product can turn out a certain way, if there's an excess of an ingredient it will influence the outcome, etc. This analogy of course is extremely simplistic, as animals' brains are plastic to a degree and they and are constantly learning from incoming stimuli from the environment. No two cakes are ever the same, even two with the same amounts of ingredients (twins), because of the baker.

It seems to me that young children learn a lot from their parents, who are basically at the center of their world (OK, maybe young children see themselves at the center of their world ;D ) and as they grow into adolescence, peers gradually take precedence over parents. The pressure to "fit in" at that age can be overwhelming. Adolescents are naturally risk-takers, he frontal part of the brain, just behind the eyes, is not yet fully developed (this process takes longer in males). Evolutionary, it's a phase in which mammals start to come into their own and venture into the world. IMO, forbidding something makes it all the more attractive, but that's my point of view, not necessarily shared by others.  :-X

I don't believe giving a young child a bottle filled with a nonalcoholic beverage will result in them growing up to be alcoholics. That's akin to saying that playing violent video games will make a person violent. It just doesn't make sense and doesn't take into consideration just how complex learning can be.

Dave, you mentioned a sweet tooth being a learned behaviour. I think there's truth to that, people can become addicted to the stuff and it acts on the brain in similar ways to some illicit drugs. Kids' brains can even be 'pre-programmed' to like certain types of food before they are born. My sister, for instance, would crave salt when she was pregnant and now my niece wants to put salt on everything! :lol:   

I totally understand this.

I, as an individual, can understand how my DNA and the environment, made me who I am today.  For some people, it ends there. People who have children have to consider how, who they are and what they do "shapes" their kids as well.

We are all so divided culturally that what seems "abusive" to some is "normal" to others. This is a crazy world. Circumsition is acceptable in some places, for whatever crazy reason, in other places is not. In some places kids drink a glass of wine, in others, they would call Social Services...even if the kid only mimicked drinking a beer.

Like Davin said, good kids come out of horrible parents, and horrible kids come out of good parents...You never know.

I just dream of a place where we will find, "the middle." Not too much of something... and don't exaggerate out of ignorance...and or cultural differences.

Edit: Added last line.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2018, 04:49:34 AM by Magdalena »

Magdalena

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Re: Talking to myself . . .
« Reply #291 on: March 03, 2018, 08:44:24 AM »
Dave,

I would like to apologize for the way I responded to your posts. I should've taken my time to say what I should've said after thinking things through. I responded from the "gut" area.
--Not good.

This is what I should have said:

Thanks, Dave, I sincerely appreciate your concern and advice about me drinking wine sometimes. I, like everyone else, enjoy wine. It is my favorite forbidden pleasure here on earth.--Yeah, it's like that!

Anyways...
I have issues, OK? Who doesn't?

I don't enjoy hearing the "experts" tell me how to raise my kids because some people misinterpret what "the experts" say. When the kid doesn't "fit" the "mold" the parents "break" the kid to fit the "desired mold." That's when I get pissed. --I mean, very upset.

Also, my first child is nothing like my third child. My third child is nothing like my second child. I"m not the same mon I was with my first child as I am with my second and will be with my last. Things are constantly changing. --Good in some areas, bad in others, you never know.

If I were to raise my kids, according to your guidelines, my Latino kids would probably get beat up here in Los Angeles, California.  :lol:

Anyways. Again, I am sorry for the rude way I behaved. I hope we can still be friends. I would never feed my kids a humanist for breakfast. A Nazi? Maybe at a party...They can be the tortilla chips..without the guacamole or salsa.

Edit: spelling.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2018, 05:57:47 PM by Magdalena »

Dave

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Re: Talking to myself . . .
« Reply #292 on: March 03, 2018, 09:58:51 AM »
Dave,

I would like to apologize for the way I responded to your posts. I should've taken my time to say what I should've said after thinking things through. I responded from the "gut" area.
--Not good.

This is what I should have said:

Thanks, Dave, I sincerely appreciate your concern and advice about me drinking wine sometimes. I, like everyone else, enjoy wine. It is my favorite forbidden pleasure here on earth.--Yeah, it's like that!

Anyways...
I have issues, OK? Who doesn't?

I don't enjoy hearing the "experts" tell me how to raise my kids because some people misinterpret what "the experts" say. When the kid doesn't "fit" the "mold" the patents "break" the kid to fit the "desired mold." That's when I get pissed. --I mean, very upset.

Also, my first child is nothing like my third child. My third child is nothing like my second child. I"m not the same mon I was with my first child as I am with my second and will be with my last. Things are constantly changing. --Good in some areas, bad in others, you never know.

If I were to raise my kids, according to your guidelines, my Latino kids would probably get beat up here in Los Angeles, California.  :lol:

Anyways. Again, I am sorry for the rude way I behaved. I hope we can still be friends. I would never feed my kids a humanist for breakfast. A Nazi? Maybe at a party...They can be the tortilla chips..without the guacamole or salsa.

Thanks, Mags.   :daisies:

I should have replied that I was making a generalisation, but - for some reason - felt that I might make things worse. You did seem rather angry!

I have no kids of my own but experience has forced me to try to be as objective as I can about my own upbringing and I watched half of my 21nieces and nephews (and some of their kids) grow at close quarters.

I fear that two of my siblings made similar mistakes to those of our parents, ending up with kids with some serious problems of their own. The exception was a half-sister. This helped form my own decision never to have kids.

Though, now in my dotage, I sorely miss the opportunity to be an elder uncle or grandfather with enthusiasms, excitments, skills and knowledge to pass on. So I do it second hand by giving money to local schools to buy kit that help with science, craft and design, photography etc. Things that are way down the budget pecking order. Oh, and I have passed on some "interesting" magnets and other stuff to a neighbour's grandson.

So, kids and their welfare and development is an important subject for me.
Tomorrow is precious, don't ruin it by fouling up today.

Magdalena

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Re: Talking to myself . . .
« Reply #293 on: March 03, 2018, 05:24:03 PM »
Thanks, Mags.   :daisies:

:daisies:
"Right back atcha, Dave."