Makes you think...

[Steeler]

I believe rudy was referring to murders, not all violent crime. According to the FBI the number is actually 49.7 percent of us murders are committed by black race in the statistic I saw.

[Magdalena]

Steeler, we can nitpick or persuade. I don't think that asking you to provide information on where your statistics came from is nitpicking. I want to believe that your statement is true:

Yes I would agree that a non white is probably more likely to be involved in a police shooting. But you also have to keep in mind that blacks commit over 50 percent of the violent crime, violent criminals I would think would be more likely to end up in a shootout with police.

...But for some reason, I don't believe it. Please convince me, or persuade me, if that's what you want to do. --With numbers if necessary, or from your own experiences--if you are a black young male in a large city in the United States. If that's not the case, maybe you can speak of your experiences as a law enforcement office that is responsible for maintaining civil peace. If that's not possible either, then provide me with where you got the statement that says, "50% of the violent crimes are committed by blacks." If you can't do that, then maybe you made it up, and that's not right. Especially because you throw the phrase, "Keep in mind..." Right before you said it. That's not something I think we "Should keep in mind."

There is a difference: Nitpick: To look for small or unimportant errors or faults, especially in order to criticize unnecessarily. I don't think Davin is doing that.

Persuade: Cause (someone) to do something through reasoning or argument. I don't think you're doing that, either...so I can't really agree with you, yet.

[Steeler]

I corrected the comment I made. Murders, not all violent crime Mag.
I think the violent crime number total was 29 percent if I'm remembering right. Still disproportionate to the population numbers.

[Tank]

Another twisted fact: the black man who was killed in Minnesota alerted the police officer that he had a firearm that he was licensed to carry before reaching for his ID, and the police officer supposedly shot him because of concern over said gun. Imagine that was a white guy, and then imagine how the NRA would have responded: screaming that someone was shot while exercising their constitutional right to bear arms. But in this case, with a black man? Not a word. But when the 5 Dallas police officers were killed? Plenty of sympathy for them.

Most police shootings are cops shooting whites. I don't hear the NRA really commenting much on individual cases, black or white.

It would be informative to see the death rate by race by police per 100,000 of the population. More white people are killed because there are more white people in America. The issue isn't the absolute number killed but the probability of being killed by race. I don't have the figures to hand but I think a non-white is proportionally more likely to be killed than a white. But do proportionally more blacks live in deprived areas where violent crime is more prevalent? Thus making the police more edgy and likely to shoot first and ask questions later?

One thing is true, this is a complex issue for which there are no sound bite answers.

Yes I would agree that a non white is probably more likely to be involved in a police shooting. But you also have to keep in mind that blacks commit over 50 percent of the violent crime, violent criminals I would think would be more likely to end up in a shootout with police.

I agree. Recognising the real problem, whatever that may be, is the only route to the real answer.

[Tank]

I didn't intentionally attempt to bait you in Davin, but I knew you couldn't resist.
My first "claim", you yourself cited as well. So good enough?
The second I actually heard Rudy Giuliani speak about couple days ago. Not good enough for you? Don't really care.

Before I replied to this post I said to myself, self, this is the topic that will lead to my banning. Lol. I've avoided these topics because of the nitpicking as was discussed in the future of the forum thread but just couldn't help myself. He he.

When I made the OP it was in the hope that we'd get some differing opinions as I don't live in the USA and would like to read what people say rather than media spin.

[Steeler]

I think a little human respect would do wonders for a lot of the problems we face.

[gentle_dissident]

Recognising the real problem, whatever that may be, is the only route to the real answer.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/investigative/2015/12/10/new-style-of-police-training-aims-to-produce-guardians-not-warriors/

It's a start.

[Steeler]

I didn't intentionally attempt to bait you in Davin, but I knew you couldn't resist.
My first "claim", you yourself cited as well. So good enough?
The second I actually heard Rudy Giuliani speak about couple days ago. Not good enough for you? Don't really care.

Before I replied to this post I said to myself, self, this is the topic that will lead to my banning. Lol. I've avoided these topics because of the nitpicking as was discussed in the future of the forum thread but just couldn't help myself. He he.

When I made the OP it was in the hope that we'd get some differing opinions as I don't live in the USA and would like to read what people say rather than media spin.

I totally get that Tank. I didn't mean to turn this ugly, not that it has yet. I can lose some respect for a guy who straight up uses profanity about something I say. I think some of what you say is bullshit, but I wouldn't break that one out on you cuz I have respect for you lol. We can disagree without getting shitty.
Edit for clarification: I was typing fast while busy at work. I shouldn't have said some of what Tank says I think is BS. That is not true.
I thought the pic in his first post was BS. But kinda humorous

[Magdalena]

I corrected the comment I made. Murders, not all violent crime Mag.
I think the violent crime number total was 29 percent if I'm remembering right. Still disproportionate to the population numbers.

Ok, well...thank you for that.
...That's a start.


Please continue. 

[Steeler]

I didn't intentionally attempt to bait you in Davin, but I knew you couldn't resist.

Yeah, you know me and my dislike for perpetuated bullshit.

My first "claim", you yourself cited as well. So good enough?

Yes, I accept that cede to my point.

Uh, that wasn't a cede. You agreed with what I said. Nice try though.

[Steeler]

http://m.townhall.com/tipsheet/justinholcomb/2016/07/11/first-black-miss-alabama-i-dont-feel-sad-for-the-officers-that-lost-their-livesshooter-was-a-martyr-n2191234?utm_content=buffer07271&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Damn, this crap doesn't help matters.

[Steeler]

I'm bored right now so I'll continue rambling.
Someone mentioned earlier police training as a potential problem. I think it is a very big piece of the problem.
I understand that there have been many instances of officers being ambushed on the side of the road by bad guys that simply don't want to go to jail, but there has got to be a balance.
There are too many (overtrained?) officers freaking out over simple movements of someone who they stop for easy stuff like traffic violations. Being a cop can be dangerous business. I get that, but a big time change in tactic is necessary.

And I'm not talking about cases where a guy attacks a police officer then runs away only to be shot in the back. Bad cop, yes indeed, but no free pass from me if you are dumb enough to start an altercation or resist.

[Steeler]

http://www.bizpacreview.com/2016/07/10/riveting-post-by-black-police-officer-confronts-blm-with-raw-honesty-and-every-american-needs-to-see-it-363067

Another very good read from a black police officer.

[Magdalena]

Steeler, you're posting a lot of stuff, what is it that you really want to say?
I'm just curious. You're posting like Pahu, right now. You're posting links, but I don't know what it is that you want to say.

...I know this is the "Makes you think..." Thread, but please, just make it easier for some of us and just say what you want to say. 

[gentle_dissident]

I know that people of all races need to mature, chill, and party on. I think that when there's talk of unity, we worry we won't be holding police or criminals responsible due to amnesty. That would be a hell of a lot of forgiveness. Maybe we'll bring back stocks. There's a sure way to start a dialogue.