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Is it fair to paint Mitt Romney as "a bully"

Started by Ali, May 10, 2012, 11:17:30 PM

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Sweetdeath

Quote from: technolud on May 14, 2012, 11:03:39 AM
I don't like bullies.  Yes we all made mistakes as kids, but to me there is a difference between smoking pot and beating up on people.  Many (all?) of my friends grew up without bullying people.

That said, it is possible to change, grow and learn.  Sounds like ThinkAnarchy did so.  Not so much Mitt.  I take this incident as a warning sign, even if it is 50 years old.

I agree. The whole "past is the past " and " kids will be kids" is not a valid  defense.
Let's stop actig ike being a bully or getting bullied is a normal thing. It's horrific. And it needs to be stopped. Whether it's the parents' faults or something else.
Law 35- "You got to go with what works." - Robin Lefler

Wiggum:"You have that much faith in me, Homer?"
Homer:"No! Faith is what you have in things that don't exist. Your awesomeness is real."

"I was thinking that perhaps this thing called God does not exist. Because He cannot save any one of us. No matter how we pray, He doesn't mend our wounds.

ThinkAnarchy

^^^

I don't think anyone in this thread is condoning bullying. It is a normal thing however. A sad reality, but a reality none the less.
"He that displays too often his wife and his wallet is in danger of having both of them borrowed." -Ben Franklin

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -credited to Franklin, but not sure.

Sweetdeath

Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on May 15, 2012, 03:22:18 AM
^^^

I don't think anyone in this thread is condoning bullying. It is a normal thing however. A sad reality, but a reality none the less.

At least people are finally being held responsible in the recent years.
Law 35- "You got to go with what works." - Robin Lefler

Wiggum:"You have that much faith in me, Homer?"
Homer:"No! Faith is what you have in things that don't exist. Your awesomeness is real."

"I was thinking that perhaps this thing called God does not exist. Because He cannot save any one of us. No matter how we pray, He doesn't mend our wounds.

Harmonie

Quote from: Sweetdeath on May 15, 2012, 05:12:49 AM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on May 15, 2012, 03:22:18 AM
^^^

I don't think anyone in this thread is condoning bullying. It is a normal thing however. A sad reality, but a reality none the less.

At least people are finally being held responsible in the recent years.

Except for when those terrible laws get passed that force school districts to remain 'neutral' on the homosexuality issue (or not speak of it). In those cases the bullies have free reign and no punishment.

Every time I hear about bullying I just can't help but think of this. I have rarely ever felt the level of disgust I felt when I read that.

Icon Image by Cherubunny on Tumblr
"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony

ThinkAnarchy

#19
Quote from: Radiant on May 15, 2012, 07:02:09 AM
Quote from: Sweetdeath on May 15, 2012, 05:12:49 AM
Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on May 15, 2012, 03:22:18 AM
^^^

I don't think anyone in this thread is condoning bullying. It is a normal thing however. A sad reality, but a reality none the less.

At least people are finally being held responsible in the recent years.

Except for when those terrible laws get passed that force school districts to remain 'neutral' on the homosexuality issue (or not speak of it). In those cases the bullies have free reign and no punishment.

Every time I hear about bullying I just can't help but think of this. I have rarely ever felt the level of disgust I felt when I read that.

Yes, those stories are very sad and there are many more like them. I did a quick google search to try and find a few that weren't as a result of being gay, but on the first half page of results couldn't find any. I find it kind of annoying. I'm certain suicide as a result of bullying isn't limited to the homosexual community alone. Why when I search, all the news articles are about gay children committing suicide?

I tried searching for suicide statistics, but the groups aren't broken up by sexual preference, so they were of little help. I did find this article though.

http://www.livescience.com/8734-gay-teen-suicide-epidemic.html

It simply annoys me. The problem is not gay teens being bullied and committing suicide. The problem are teens being bullied for what ever reason and committing suicide.

This isn't an attack on you, it likely would have been hard to find a suicide story that didn't involve a gay child. The narrow minded reporting by the media annoys the hell out of me though.

With that said, in the article you posted, the town seems to have a serious problem with this particular type of bullying, but that is a localized problem. It's sensational, sure, but doesn't exactly explain why nationally, the only suicide articles that gain traction are of gay youths. I'm not saying it isn't a problem that should be handled, but other situations of teen bullying should be discussed as well. It isn't simply a gay/straight problem, that is all I'm saying. "4 of the 9 were gay or perceived gay," which suggests it isn't simply such a narrow problem there as well. I didn't read the full 5 pages, so it's possible I missed something important.
"He that displays too often his wife and his wallet is in danger of having both of them borrowed." -Ben Franklin

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -credited to Franklin, but not sure.

Sweetdeath

Everyone has a gay friend or loved one. There is absolutely no.need for this level.of bullying ,  or intolerance and ignorance!!!
Law 35- "You got to go with what works." - Robin Lefler

Wiggum:"You have that much faith in me, Homer?"
Homer:"No! Faith is what you have in things that don't exist. Your awesomeness is real."

"I was thinking that perhaps this thing called God does not exist. Because He cannot save any one of us. No matter how we pray, He doesn't mend our wounds.

ThinkAnarchy

#21
Quote from: Sweetdeath on May 16, 2012, 02:17:31 AM
Everyone has a gay friend or loved one. There is absolutely no.need for this level.of bullying ,  or intolerance and ignorance!!!

I agree, but based on the three exclamation points, I think you may have missed the point of my last post...  ??? Perhaps the exclamation points are simply because homosexual bullying hits close to home for you while generic bullying doesn't.

Added: Or that may not have been in relation to my post.  :)
"He that displays too often his wife and his wallet is in danger of having both of them borrowed." -Ben Franklin

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -credited to Franklin, but not sure.

Amicale

Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on May 16, 2012, 02:29:07 AM
Quote from: Sweetdeath on May 16, 2012, 02:17:31 AM
Everyone has a gay friend or loved one. There is absolutely no.need for this level.of bullying ,  or intolerance and ignorance!!!

I agree, but based on the three exclamation points, I think you may have missed the point of my last post...  ??? Perhaps the exclamation points are simply because homosexual bullying hits close to home for you while generic bullying doesn't.

Bullying in general is one of my personal issues. Being in the education field, I've sat on anti-bullying committees before, took part in 'wear pink on anti bullying day' awareness activities, worked with others to create 'safe space' classrooms during the lunch hour where bullied kids could come every day and eat in peace without fear of being harassed, etc etc. I've seen bullying at its worst, and while I've seen gay students being bullied, I've seen plenty get bullied because they had special needs, were a certain colour, or religion, or height, or weight. All bullying is unacceptable.

What makes it worse is that while kids are in schools, they have a certain level of protection and recourse -- there are safe adults to go talk to, safe places to go, etc. Out in the 'real world' away from school, bullies sometimes grow into adults who bully, and they take these habits into their workplaces, marriages, and neighborhoods. And there's generally no safety net any longer for those getting bullied, not until it comes to physical blows.  >:(

Anyways, I think all of this is going outside the scope of the original thread about Romney, so I'll attempt to bring it back to him: I don't think it's wise to judge someone on their gradeschool actions, but if it's true that he denied remembering them, and then offered only a halfhearted apology, that's a HUGE problem right there. He may have lost himself the votes of a LOT of teachers, parents of bullied kids, and tons of people in the education field in general, not to mention those in the medical field who help patch up people who have been badly bullied or otherwise harmed. Shame he didn't take the opportunity to really address the issue. I hope at some point in the future, he chooses to.



"Our lives are not our own. From womb to tomb we are bound to others. By every crime and act of kindness we birth our future." - Cloud Atlas

"To live in the hearts of those we leave behind is to never die." -Carl Sagan

Firebird

TA:

There has been more attention to cases of gay teens committing suicide recently, but you have to keep it in context. Before Dan Savage's "It Gets Better" campaign, people were far too ignorant about the abuse gay teens go through, and they're only now beginning to explore this in popular media, sadly. Not to mention high-profile cases like the Tyler Clementi case at Rutgers.
That being said, there have indeed been some high-profile cases of teen suicide over bullying that were not related to homosexuality. For example, Phoebe Prince, which was all over the news in MA, or Amanda Cummings more recently.

"Great, replace one book about an abusive, needy asshole with another." - Will (moderator) on replacing hotel Bibles with "Fifty Shades of Grey"

ThinkAnarchy

^^^

Ok, I was simply going off the google results I was getting. I knew I had read some in the past, but couldn't remember enough information to find any of them.

Sorry for the slight derail, but The Office did a fairly funny scene with "It gets better." The rest of the office kept interrupting, and not really backing up the whole idea of it getting much better. I agree that people should be encouraged to accept homosexuals and not bully them. I still think the bigger message should be to simply not bully though. I am glad the media does report on other cases as well though.
"He that displays too often his wife and his wallet is in danger of having both of them borrowed." -Ben Franklin

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." -credited to Franklin, but not sure.

Amicale

Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on May 16, 2012, 02:40:47 AM
^^^

Ok, I was simply going off the google results I was getting. I knew I had read some in the past, but couldn't remember enough information to find any of them.

Sorry for the slight derail, but The Office did a fairly funny scene with "It gets better." The rest of the office kept interrupting, and not really backing up the whole idea of it getting much better. I agree that people should be encouraged to accept homosexuals and not bully them. I still think the bigger message should be to simply not bully though. I am glad the media does report on other cases as well though.

One of my students told me the other day that while she was in highschool, all the kids were very aware of the issues gay kids have who are bullied, and they paid close attention to and defended any gay student who was teased or harassed. Meanwhile, she was shoved into lockers and her hijab was pulled violently off her head just because she was Muslim, and nobody stood up to help her. I felt so bad for her. This wasn't a North American school, it was in Europe. So I see the awareness is slowly becoming global, but it's a limited awareness. We need to put an end to bullying in general. Not just one sort. It's becoming popular in the media and in politics to speak often of gay students who are bullied, but we need to talk about bullying itself, as well. So many people fall through the cracks when they're in a group that isn't currently popular.


"Our lives are not our own. From womb to tomb we are bound to others. By every crime and act of kindness we birth our future." - Cloud Atlas

"To live in the hearts of those we leave behind is to never die." -Carl Sagan

Sweetdeath

Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on May 16, 2012, 02:29:07 AM
Quote from: Sweetdeath on May 16, 2012, 02:17:31 AM
Everyone has a gay friend or loved one. There is absolutely no.need for this level.of bullying ,  or intolerance and ignorance!!!

I agree, but based on the three exclamation points, I think you may have missed the point of my last post...  ??? Perhaps the exclamation points are simply because homosexual bullying hits close to home for you while generic bullying doesn't.

Added: Or that may not have been in relation to my post.  :)


No, no xD it wasnt in response to you. Lol
Law 35- "You got to go with what works." - Robin Lefler

Wiggum:"You have that much faith in me, Homer?"
Homer:"No! Faith is what you have in things that don't exist. Your awesomeness is real."

"I was thinking that perhaps this thing called God does not exist. Because He cannot save any one of us. No matter how we pray, He doesn't mend our wounds.

Firebird

Quote from: ThinkAnarchy on May 16, 2012, 02:40:47 AM
I still think the bigger message should be to simply not bully though. I am glad the media does report on other cases as well though.
Agreed. I think your point was valid.
"Great, replace one book about an abusive, needy asshole with another." - Will (moderator) on replacing hotel Bibles with "Fifty Shades of Grey"