So you just died and...

[Sandra Craft]

I am absolutely stunned how Christians can believe in this rubbish.

It's traditional rubbish.  Things become a tradition because in some way they're useful and serving a purpose for a number of people.  The problem is that once anything becomes a tradition, getting rid of it becomes about 1,000 times harder, not matter how ridiculous or destructive it is.

By the way, I was wrong about the South Park guys claiming Heaven had a pop. of 4,000 (I think that's the Mormon estimate for the number of saved), South Park only gave it a pop. of 1,656:  Little boy you're going to Hell

[not your typical...]

You would get in on Asmo's power-tripping Hellshop idea though, yes? 

Yes, I would love to. I want 40% of the profits, and I could market them in Heaven. You'd be surprised how many heathens get in there.
But on a slightly more serious note, if you did die by whatever means, and found out the God is real, firstly, you wouldn't be given the chance to repent. He would talk of how you denied Him on Earth so He must deny you Heaven. Second, (Mainly directed at Davin) while living according to typical moral codes and having good ethics are all fine and well, that won't get you into Heaven. Being a good person is nice, but you have to be a Christian, meaning believing in God and the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Why is there an assumption that the god would be wrathful and/or angry? Might not need to do anything. In any case, I'm doing the best I can to make sure that I understand reality and to make decisions according to reality, if that makes the god angry, then there really isn't much I can do about that, so there is no reason to argue.
How does this belief thing work anyway?

Also to answer you question about belief, it's not about imagining the correct God. It's about understanding who He is and what He can do. (You know, the typical saying "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." and the stuff about Him creating the universe and light and just about everything we find on earth today.) So you don't have to imagine the correct TV. Think of it as if it were the mind of a child. They don't fully understand that their imaginary friends aren't real, just like Christians don't believe that God isn't real.
And third, God is a merciful being, wanting nothing but the best for His children. The only thing He hates is sin, so unless you're a bigger sinner than me, I'm pretty sure He shouldn't be too terrible pissed off.
*Note: This is all stuff that I've been brainwashed with all my life.

I would use no argument. I would tell god to go and fuck himself.

And if you do find that there is a God, I would take your place in Hell just to hear you repent, swear on my afterlife. Js.

[Tristan Jay]

I love this thread, and the responses here!

My favorites are Norfolk's, Asmodean's, and Budhorse 4.  Send us the key, Magic Pudding.

I would ask him why he minimizes his sons sacrifice with laziness on his part.

I would ask why he exercises a double standard between him and us, and point out that most humans have a better track record within his own system than he does.

I would tell him to stop embarrassing himself.

Oh, hell; whatever.  I'd probably scream my lungs out cursing him, and try and bury an axe in his face, for my own satisfaction as well as to save the human race from his fuckishness.  I'm obsessed with the idea of chopping into his face with an axe.  I have no homicidal inclination of this order with anyone, but he is the exception.  If I didn't have an axe, I would still try to throttle him, or try anything in the hope of making a dent.

Asmodean, I want in on your R&D Deicidal weaponry shop.  Please?

[not your typical...]

I love this thread, and the responses here!

My favorites are Norfolk's, Asmodean's, and Budhorse 4.  Send us the key, Magic Pudding.

I would ask him why he minimizes his sons sacrifice with laziness on his part.

I would ask why he exercises a double standard between him and us, and point out that most humans have a better track record within his own system than he does.

I would tell him to stop embarrassing himself.

Oh, hell; whatever.  I'd probably scream my lungs out cursing him, and try and bury an axe in his face, for my own satisfaction as well as to save the human race from his fuckishness.  I'm obsessed with the idea of chopping into his face with an axe.  I have no homicidal of this order with anyone, except him.  If I didn't have an axe, I would still try to throttle him, or try anything in the hope of making a dent.

Asmodean, I want in on your R&D Deicidal weaponry shop.  Please?

Being a Christian, I probably shouldn't love this response as much as i do... but to hell with it. That's awesome.

[Davin]

Why is there an assumption that the god would be wrathful and/or angry? Might not need to do anything. In any case, I'm doing the best I can to make sure that I understand reality and to make decisions according to reality, if that makes the god angry, then there really isn't much I can do about that, so there is no reason to argue.
How does this belief thing work anyway?

Also to answer you question about belief, it's not about imagining the correct God. It's about understanding who He is and what He can do. (You know, the typical saying "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." and the stuff about Him creating the universe and light and just about everything we find on earth today.) So you don't have to imagine the correct TV. Think of it as if it were the mind of a child. They don't fully understand that their imaginary friends aren't real, just like Christians don't believe that God isn't real.

Then it doesn't matter which religion in your opinion?

And third, God is a merciful being, wanting nothing but the best for His children. The only thing He hates is sin, so unless you're a bigger sinner than me, I'm pretty sure He shouldn't be too terrible pissed off.
*Note: This is all stuff that I've been brainwashed with all my life.

You should probably be careful with your thinking, that is the reasoning I went through about your age and just a few years later, I was an atheist.

[not your typical...]

Then it doesn't matter which religion in your opinion?
You should probably be careful with your thinking, that is the reasoning I went through about your age and just a few years later, I was an atheist.

Like I said, so long as you believe in the death, burial, and resurrection of JC, ur good. And you're saying that to protect me from becoming an atheist?

[Davin]

Then it doesn't matter which religion in your opinion?
You should probably be careful with your thinking, that is the reasoning I went through about your age and just a few years later, I was an atheist.

Like I said, so long as you believe in the death, burial, and resurrection of JC, ur good.

That's a bit more specific, that is like imagining the correct brand of TV.

And you're saying that to protect me from becoming an atheist?

I did not have any intention of persuading you one way or another, I mostly just advocate for self reflection. Secondly, I can't protect you from anything, so I wouldn't try.

[DeterminedJuliet]

Sooooo, if I don't believe in God, he'll be pissed at me after I die.
But I can still "talk" to him after I die? What would be the point? So he can scold me?
God sounds passive-aggressive.

[Sandra Craft]

Then it doesn't matter which religion in your opinion?
You should probably be careful with your thinking, that is the reasoning I went through about your age and just a few years later, I was an atheist.

Like I said, so long as you believe in the death, burial, and resurrection of JC, ur good.

That's a bit more specific, that is like imagining the correct brand of TV.

And it's still assuming that this is the correct brand of TV, and that one of the other brands that claims more or other things are required is not, in fact, the correct one.  There's absolutely no way of knowing for sure.

[Stevil]

Like I said, so long as you believe in the death, burial, and resurrection of JC, ur good. And you're saying that to protect me from becoming an atheist?

This is silly talk, right?
Your actions don't matter, just as long as you believe without evidence in three events belonging to a person called Jesus...

Sounds like rubbish.

[xSilverPhinx]

Like I said, so long as you believe in the death, burial, and resurrection of JC, ur good. And you're saying that to protect me from becoming an atheist?

This is silly talk, right?
Your actions don't matter, just as long as you believe without evidence in three events belonging to a person called Jesus...

Sounds like rubbish.

Agreed. So all the worse kind of criminals go to heaven and receive the ultimate reward just because they believe.

All of this is just so insanely out there. What a mess religion is.

[xSilverPhinx]

Sooooo, if I don't believe in God, he'll be pissed at me after I die.
But I can still "talk" to him after I die? What would be the point? So he can scold me?
God sounds passive-aggressive.

Passive-aggressive? I'm afraid you understate...

Dawkins put it nicely:  


"The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully."

Incredibly tribal. Which parts of those would you identify with, Ransom, as someone who is "too Christian"?

(And really, be careful what you wish for, you want or feel you need an authoritarian tyrant, that's what you'll get. Worth stressing that.)

[Sandra Craft]

Incredibly tribal. Which parts of those would you identify with, Ransom, as someone who is "too Christian"?

It seems to me "too Xtian" would refer to adhering unreasonably to the New Testament rather than the Old.  Maybe he was insisting the wealthy give all their riches to the poor, as Jesus suggested (love to see a conservative politician try to get away with that some day).

[Fi]

I'd ask him what his deal is.

If the Christian god truly loved us and didn't want us to go to Hell, he shouldn't have set us up for failure with the Garden of Eden. Besides that, he could easily change the rules at any time and allow all of his "beloved children" into Heaven. He's God. If he is omniscient, all-powerful, and always right, there's no logical reason he could not do this.

I'm always hearing this bullshit from Creationists that GOD IS SAD AND DOESN'T WANT YOU TO GO TO HELL A BLOO BLOO BLOO

Well then fix it, God! Sheesh! Do I have to do everything for you?

[not your typical...]

So all the worse kind of criminals go to heaven and receive the ultimate reward just because they believe.
All of this is just so insanely out there. What a mess religion is.

I never claimed it made sense. This is just what is taught in most of the churches I've been to. If you've ever heard of the Chick Publications tracts, there's one that show a serial killer going to Heaven because he repented for his sins and asked God into his life, where as the sheriff, who was a good man, went to Hell because he never was a Christian.