Author Topic: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US  (Read 418 times)

Recusant

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Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« on: February 24, 2017, 05:40:31 AM »
I don't think this will be the last we hear of this sort of thing.

"Islamophobia grows louder in North Carolina: 'Can we not kill them all?'" | The Guardian

Quote
Those present laid out a scenario based on false representations of Islam and tangled conspiracy theories suggesting mainstream Muslims were stealthily plotting to kill non-believers.

Jones told the audience that the Muslim Brotherhood required every Muslim to participate in jihad, and that “any Muslim – that means Muslims right here in this area, all over this country – any Muslim who opposes these goals or these methods is called a kafir, which is a nonbeliever, apostate, Muslim who has given up on Islam. That’s a sin punishable by death.”

Robert Goodwill, who identified himself as a member of the group Act for America – described by the Southern Poverty Law Center as “the largest grassroots anti-Muslim group in America” – added for good measure: “By the way, you’re all kafirs.”

Near the end of the presentation, Del Valle asked Jones: “Do you have any recommendations as to how we could stop this? Because my only recommendation is to start killing the hell out of them.”

Goodwill attempted to steer the discussion away from violence, noting that the election of Donald Trump was a positive development for their cause.

“There’s a huge pushback coming,” Goodwill said. “Political correctness is being thrown away. A lot of people are meeting like this. We’re making progress in the positive direction.”

“I am beyond that point,” Del Valle replied. “I’m ready to start taking people out.”

Goodwill responded, “I can understand that. We’re not there yet.”

[Continues . . .]

I despise Islam, but have absolutely no sympathy for the people described in the story above.

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Dave

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Re: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2017, 08:38:02 AM »
They are of exactly the same sort of mindset as those they hate.

Thus they deserve exactly the same treatment.

Pity we can't just put them all together on an usland in the middle if the Atlantic and leave them to it. But we would have more respect for the wildlife there and not want to damage that.
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Icarus

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Re: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2017, 08:47:27 PM »
I shudder to learn that we have active conspiracy lunatics in our midst.   I can not help but wonder whether there is some kind of mental illness that infects a certain group of individuals.

I am close to believing that there may be some kind of virus that causes a corruption of our faculties.  I have, more correctly, I had, a lifelong friend who is uncommonly well educated, an intelligent business man, and a fine human being.  He has become a raving maniac about political matters. He has become a Saul Alinsky  insurrectionist type. Here is a guy that has morphed from a responsible citizen to someone who believes all kinds of conspiracies exist right here in River City.  I have lost a dear friend that was for all practical purposes, my brother.  We are no longer in contact with one another. We need some serious clinical study for cases like my friend along with the crazies in North Carolina and elsewhere.

 Our resident brain research person xSP might have some comments about the subject.

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Re: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2017, 08:57:49 PM »
I shudder to learn that we have active conspiracy lunatics in our midst.   I can not help but wonder whether there is some kind of mental illness that infects a certain group of individuals.

I am close to believing that there may be some kind of virus that causes a corruption of our faculties.  I have, more correctly, I had, a lifelong friend who is uncommonly well educated, an intelligent business man, and a fine human being.  He has become a raving maniac about political matters. He has become a Saul Alinsky  insurrectionist type. Here is a guy that has morphed from a responsible citizen to someone who believes all kinds of conspiracies exist right here in River City.  I have lost a dear friend that was for all practical purposes, my brother.  We are no longer in contact with one another. We need some serious clinical study for cases like my friend along with the crazies in North Carolina and elsewhere.

 Our resident brain research person xSP might have some comments about the subject.
Perhaps it is a similar malady to those the incurably religious suffer from?

The "sheep" gene, inflicts the possessor with the need to join groups of people encouraged by individuals who tell them what to think and how to act.
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Re: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2017, 01:36:20 PM »
I shudder to learn that we have active conspiracy lunatics in our midst.   I can not help but wonder whether there is some kind of mental illness that infects a certain group of individuals.

I am close to believing that there may be some kind of virus that causes a corruption of our faculties.  I have, more correctly, I had, a lifelong friend who is uncommonly well educated, an intelligent business man, and a fine human being.  He has become a raving maniac about political matters. He has become a Saul Alinsky  insurrectionist type. Here is a guy that has morphed from a responsible citizen to someone who believes all kinds of conspiracies exist right here in River City.  I have lost a dear friend that was for all practical purposes, my brother.  We are no longer in contact with one another. We need some serious clinical study for cases like my friend along with the crazies in North Carolina and elsewhere.

 Our resident brain research person xSP might have some comments about the subject.

While I find this kind f thing interesting from a psychological perspective, I am by no means an expert. Have you read Michael Shermer's The Believing Brain: From Ghosts and Gods to Politics and Conspiracies---How We Construct Beliefs and Reinforce Them as Truths?

He even gave a TED Talk on the subject:



:)
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Dave

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Re: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2017, 02:25:34 PM »
I enjoyed that, xSP thanks.

Especially the last bit!
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Re: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2017, 02:37:05 PM »
I shudder to learn that we have active conspiracy lunatics in our midst.   I can not help but wonder whether there is some kind of mental illness that infects a certain group of individuals.

I am close to believing that there may be some kind of virus that causes a corruption of our faculties.  I have, more correctly, I had, a lifelong friend who is uncommonly well educated, an intelligent business man, and a fine human being.  He has become a raving maniac about political matters. He has become a Saul Alinsky  insurrectionist type. Here is a guy that has morphed from a responsible citizen to someone who believes all kinds of conspiracies exist right here in River City.  I have lost a dear friend that was for all practical purposes, my brother.  We are no longer in contact with one another. We need some serious clinical study for cases like my friend along with the crazies in North Carolina and elsewhere.

 Our resident brain research person xSP might have some comments about the subject.

While I find this kind f thing interesting from a psychological perspective, I am by no means an expert. Have you read Michael Shermer's The Believing Brain: From Ghosts and Gods to Politics and Conspiracies---How We Construct Beliefs and Reinforce Them as Truths?

He even gave a TED Talk on the subject:



:)

We humans seem capable of seeing recognizable forms in a whole host of random images as Michael stated in the video or believing in an even larger collection of nonsense, silly notions or ideas along with far reaching unbelievable conspiracies.
My sister's mother-in-law passed away last year, and she was a very kind, warm hearted person, who taught music at a small college here in Michigan for over 30 years.
She was a smart woman, college educated, worked as a professor, and she believed in a huge amount of conspiratorial and pseudo-science nonsense. It made no sense at all, and no amount of contrary evidence or discussions could convince her otherwise. For example she believed the entire nonsense of contrails to the extent she would wear a face mask when outside, and my sister said if they would come over her house to pick her up to go somewhere and she saw a contrail in the sky she would refuse to leave the house until it dissipated to her satisfaction.

It was sad really, of course she was extremely religious which seems to go hand in hand with most of the woo and bunk out there.

Good video, and I really liked how he ended it with the song by Katie Melua. I really love her voice, and enjoy a couple songs she does, but this certainly raised my opinion of her.

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Icarus

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Re: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2017, 06:34:11 PM »
Thank you for that xSP.

Shermer is good at that kind of thing. The vid had some links. One of them was Dan Dennett with his talk about Dangerous Memes.  Dennett's  talk plays into the question also.

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Re: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2017, 06:56:52 PM »
Here's another good one in which he briefly describes some of the mechanisms which might lead to weird beliefs:

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Dave

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Re: Anti-Muslim Ideologues in the US
« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2017, 08:13:22 PM »
Thanks for the link again, xSP, I could get to like this man! Like his style.

Trouble is it led on to the Oxford Union debate on the existence, or not, of God. So I listened to Shermer and (Peter) Hitchins taking opposing sides. Maybe it's groupthink or incestuous amplification but I went for Shermer - though both offered some very tired arguments.

Looked a bit like some forum debates actually . . .



Might get round to listening to the other participants tomorrow.

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