Author Topic: The monster that is Amazon  (Read 288 times)

Gloucester

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The monster that is Amazon
« on: February 05, 2017, 07:57:34 AM »
Anazon has growna bit over the past ten years - wonder where it will lead in the next ten? What effect will it have on economies, will it pay its taxes nicely?




Nudging the bracket is China's Alibaba at over $200b in 2015. But if you add Aliexpress and Alipay into it . . .
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joeactor

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2017, 08:56:59 AM »
I hear they're still in the red, though.

Seems like a possible strategy may be to squeeze everyone else out of business, then raise prices.

That being said, I'm a Amazon Prime member and it is crazy convenient.

Ecurb Noselrub

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2017, 10:28:16 AM »
It's good to be Jeff Bezos.

Real Time Net Worth As of 2/5/17
$69.8 Billion
CEO and Founder, Amazon.com
Age   53
Source Of Wealth   Amazon.com, Self Made
Self-Made Score   8
Residence   Seattle, WA
Citizenship   United States
Marital Status   Married
Children   4
Education   Bachelor of Arts / Science, Princeton University
Jeff Bezos on Forbes Lists
#14 Powerful People (2016)
#17 in 2015
#2 Forbes 400 (2016)
#2 Richest In Tech (2016)
Global Game Changers (2016)
#5 Billionaires (2016)
#3 in United States

Amazon's chief Jeff Bezos added $20 billion to his net worth over 14 months through December 2016, the largest gain of anyone in the world. The online retailer's stock has shares soared thanks in part to its booming cloud-computing unit, Amazon Web Services. Bezos boasted at the 2016 shareholders meeting that Amazon is the fastest company ever to reach $100 billion in annual sales, which it cleared in 2015. Big gains often come from taking bold risks.
(Forbes)

Seems like more and more wealth is being concentrated in Seattle.

Gloucester

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2017, 10:42:33 AM »
Quote
Seems like more and more wealth is being concentrated in Seattle.

Yeah, but in what percentage of its total population, Bruce? From rumours about what Amazon pay their ordinary staff . . .
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Ecurb Noselrub

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2017, 12:12:32 PM »
Quote
Seems like more and more wealth is being concentrated in Seattle.

Yeah, but in what percentage of its total population, Bruce? From rumours about what Amazon pay their ordinary staff . . .

It wasn't in the top 10 of this 2015 study on median wealth.  Median is a better measure than mean as it discounts the outlier of extreme wealth. 

http://247wallst.com/special-report/2015/05/12/10-richest-cities-in-america/3/


Gloucester

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2017, 01:15:17 PM »
Seatyke looks like one of those areas thst is as big as the bit uou look st! Do you include the whole metropolitan area or just the city? But, looks like about 650 kilopeeps..

In a smaller population one Mega Rich Person with a large estate can skew average values upwards - whilst the lowest 50% is actually in dire straits if not actual poverty.

Rich CEOs and owners do not always pay good wages. In fact in some cases they may be rich because of that very fact!

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Icarus

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2017, 06:27:28 PM »
There is a colossal fulfilment center (amazon warehouse) within 20 miles of my house. They actually pay at least local average wage or even somewhat better. 

Gloucester

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2017, 12:59:32 AM »
There is a colossal fulfilment center (amazon warehouse) within 20 miles of my house. They actually pay at least local average wage or even somewhat better.
A little surprised, but we have a saying here about not "shitting on your own doordtep"!

The rumours in the UK were of almost Dickensian  work conditions:  low wages, very strict rules etc.  Not actually sure if that still applies.

On Joeactor's comment on raising prices . . . They did, of course, scrap totally free postage yonks ago. Don't sell enough to notice if selling fees have increased.

Seller's set their own base prices but a lot of stuff comes from China. Really cheap and often nasty. It was iften said the Chinese plot was to destroy Western industry then hike their prices. There has been some social and industrial action in China against the poor working conditions and wages and poor social services. Improving these will cost a lot of money and China's GDP has suffered a bit.

The price hike msy not be far away but maybe not due to Amazon's top of the tree position. Though, since seller fees are a percentage, such a hike will help Amazon grow.
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Icarus

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2017, 07:41:01 PM »
I do not see E-Bay on the opening chart. I suspect that they also belong in the big time as well.

My wife Elaine, is a power seller on E Bay. She specializes in products from Bath and Body Works. Never mind guys you wont know about that.....the girls will probably be familiar with the brand. Elaine ships anywhere from ten to forty packages a day. Sometimes to far away places like Peru or Indonesia.  In the region of 100 to 500 dollars of daily billing.   She is one of thousands and thousands of sellers who do a lot of business. There are maybe millions of smaller time sellers. 

The deal is that that between E bay and  Pay Pal the vigorish (that's the money that that e bay and pay pal charges for their services) is roughly 13 percent of the sale price. .  They even charge a commission on the shipping charges that are paid to the US postal service, Fed Ex, or United postal Service (UPS). Thirteen percent of a daily transaction in the many E Bay multi millions of dollars is not chump change. E bay is a colossal force in the economic scheme of things. They make a scandalous amount of money I reckon..... AMazon is an emerging giant. E bay is already a giant..........


Arturo

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2017, 10:04:04 PM »
I know Ebay and Amazon are the biggest out there right now but let's not forget about 3D printing. Almost anything you want could be printed off of these things and could replace these websites. I don't know of any detailed potential for this to happen, but if you can make anything you want in your living room, wouldn't you?

Windows 10 already has an app that comes with to make 3D printing possible. And once the making and distributing of 3D models become mainstream it could be all over for Amazon & Ebay unless they get people to sell the plans as well.
But, uh...well there it is.


Gloucester

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2017, 12:44:57 AM »
I do not see E-Bay on the opening chart. I suspect that they also belong in the big time as well.

My wife Elaine, is a power seller on E Bay. She specializes in products from Bath and Body Works. Never mind guys you wont know about that.....the girls will probably be familiar with the brand. Elaine ships anywhere from ten to forty packages a day. Sometimes to far away places like Peru or Indonesia.  In the region of 100 to 500 dollars of daily billing.   She is one of thousands and thousands of sellers who do a lot of business. There are maybe millions of smaller time sellers. 

The deal is that that between E bay and  Pay Pal the vigorish (that's the money that that e bay and pay pal charges for their services) is roughly 13 percent of the sale price. .  They even charge a commission on the shipping charges that are paid to the US postal service, Fed Ex, or United postal Service (UPS). Thirteen percent of a daily transaction in the many E Bay multi millions of dollars is not chump change. E bay is a colossal force in the economic scheme of things. They make a scandalous amount of money I reckon..... AMazon is an emerging giant. E bay is already a giant..........

The original list was retailers, not service providers. As well as supplying a service to sellers, like Ebay, Amazon also sells direct. I suspect that makes some difference.

Ebay's "market cap" last year was about $28bn according to Forbes. Not sure exactly what "market cap" is hut Amazon's is over $380bn.

Even that looks "medium" ccompared with Apple.



http://www.cnbc.com/2016/09/23/amazon-climbs-into-list-of-top-five-largest-us-stocks-by-market-cap.html
« Last Edit: February 07, 2017, 12:58:09 AM by Gloucester »
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Mr. B

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2017, 09:26:17 PM »
I'm all for free market capitalism in the classical sense but every one of those companies have a vested interest in maintaining their strangle hold in their respective markets. And every single one of those companies have lobbyists,with deep pockets, talking to the people we elected to represent us. One of those companies now has a former CEO in charge of the State Department.

For all my adult life I have viewed minimum wage workers as the modern slave class. I currently make $9 an hour and still feel like a slave with just a tiny bit more autonomy and rights than the originals had. I mean, sure...I am free to go work for another slave master for the same money. Slide to the left or slide to the right, that's easy enough but it's very difficult to climb up...much less get out and I am a white male born right here in good ol America. I can't imagine how difficult it must be for people coming here with nothing, looking for the American dream.

We have silicon valley and the largest employers of the world arguing that we need to keep a porous border so they can continue to rape third world people with shitty wages and even shittier benefits. They don't want to pay union wages....so it's either sweat shops overseas and south of the border or it's mass immigration to save a penny. All for what?

Freedom?

Democracy?

The American dream?

nope.

Whether I look left or I look right the only motivating factor I see is greed and exploitation. Both parties are heavily lobbied to keep wages down and both parties capitulate. They just spin different narratives to excuse their actions but they both still cater to modern slavery....One does it by offering a chicken in every pot and a car in every garage in exchange for a vote while the other does it by promising to keep prices low for ordinary consumers through globalization.

Either way. The only thing that has changed is that today's slaves can choose their masters and they receive a little bit of money for their labor.

/rant
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Arturo

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2017, 11:45:13 PM »
Mr. B I feel you on that one. That is the main reason I am trying to get into welding, because it pays well, it's cheap, and it's quick to get a certificate compared to other degrees. I won't be making 55k a year like my Dad does at his factory job, but I'll be making a good amount of money for a single guy.

I'm only relying on outside forces that have so far showed to be unreliable, which is a problem. But if and when I get my certificate, I will have a good amount saved up after a year from getting a job. After a few years I hope to get a safer and less taxing job/degree that also pays well.
But, uh...well there it is.


Gloucester

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2017, 11:48:00 PM »
Yes, well said Mr B.
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Davin

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Re: The monster that is Amazon
« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2017, 06:44:03 AM »
I'm all for free market capitalism in the classical sense but every one of those companies have a vested interest in maintaining their strangle hold in their respective markets.
I agree with that. I would like to add that I think the more monopolistic a company gets, the less true capitalism works. When a company is bad under capitalism, then the people buying things is supposed be a deterrent because the people presumably will not buy from that company any more. But now companies are super huge conglomerates and it's often difficult to find every single company to avoid supporting with money. That's the way they want it, they want it to be stable for them.

Then the other problem is the low paid workers who do not have enough money to discriminate. So they can't disagree with their spending as much as they may like, but they can't do much disagreeing which is what the companies want.

As all these giant corporations sought and fought for stability and safety, they have destroyed capitalism, which in itself is not a horrible system. As long as it's regulated to prevent people using capitalism to grow big enough to destroy it.

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