God is perfect

[Gawen]

If God can't manage to communicate unambiguiously he really is a fucking waste of space.

Yahwee needs a course in communications.

And human resources....and public relations...and sociology....and a course in parenting would really help.

Well, hell. God just needs to grow up!

So much for perfection.

[Whitney]

Jesus had another way of describing it, but I'd probably be banned for saying it. That's the power of Christ for you.

Are you implying that Jesus is uncivil and wouldn't be able to post here without getting banned?  Sounds like self projection as god to me.

[Gawen]

Wait a minute; if Gawen's writings require interpretation...

I thought what I wrote was rather straight forward. Or is it that you are so consumed by symbolism, allegory and defining secret wisdom that you cannot understand what I say...

...might it not be possible that the Gospels need interpretation to understand them?

For something ambiguously and vaguely written with a good portion of it written for Jews, well, I see that you have no choice.

The Gospels are so deeply interwoven with symbolism, allegory, secret wisdom and even riddles meant to be figured out that to just take them on the surface so concretely would only lead to destruction.

Gosh, and all this from a loving God. The only thing missing in the Bible is a crossword and sudoku puzzle.

You have to be spiritual in nature to read the Gospels and understand them.

I don't recall seeing in the Bible that this is so. Care to share a piece of scripture?

They are mystical documents.

I really do not see the mysticism of:
Abandon all your Earthly ambitions.
•   Forsake your Earthly family and give your loyalty to God and your fellow believers.  
•   Sell everything you own and use the money to do good works.  
•   Avoid receiving any Earthly reward for your good works.  
•   Follow the Mosaic Law, both the letter and the spirit of it.  
etc.

Talking to atheists about the true meaning of the teachings of Jesus Christ is pretty much pointless.

Another fallacy.

Jesus had another way of describing it, but I'd probably be banned for saying it.

I would wager not if you put verse numbers with it.

That's the power of Christ for you.

Well, that's a lot of woo. We've seen gobs of the perfect power of perfect Jesus in the last 200 centuries. Why, He's even set a record this year and it ain't even done with the first month!

You're full of air Egor. But the air isn't even hot air, what with the cold and heartless things some of you say to us. Symbolism, allegory and alleged secret wisdom leads you only to the god in your imagination. The last thing I would say to you  is:
"Seek to purify your own character, strive to "be perfect, even as your father in Heaven is perfect." before you seek to condemn others for their alleged imperfections.

[Stevil]

Wait a minute; if Gawen's writings require interpretation...

I thought what I wrote was rather straight forward. Or is it that you are so consumed by symbolism, allegory and defining secret wisdom that you cannot understand what I say...

It is great that you are around Gawen so that we can ask you for clarification. Otherwise I am sure we would get it wrong.
Imagine if our eternal happiness or damnation was based on getting it right and if you couldn't be bothered to clarify, we'd be up shit creek.

[Sandra Craft]

Jesus had another way of describing it, but I'd probably be banned for saying it. That's the power of Christ for you.

Are you implying that Jesus is uncivil and wouldn't be able to post here without getting banned?  Sounds like self projection as god to me.

That's one of the perks of creating gods.

[Sandra Craft]

The Gospels are so deeply interwoven with symbolism, allegory, secret wisdom and even riddles meant to be figured out that to just take them on the surface so concretely would only lead to destruction.

I have a feeling anyone who wished to could take any book in the world -- Bambi, for instance -- and make the same claim.

[Too Few Lions]

The Gospels are so deeply interwoven with symbolism, allegory, secret wisdom and even riddles meant to be figured out that to just take them on the surface so concretely would only lead to destruction.

You have to be spiritual in nature to read the Gospels and understand them. They are mystical documents. Talking to atheists about the true meaning of the teachings of Jesus Christ is pretty much pointless. Jesus had another way of describing it, but I'd probably be banned for saying it. That's the power of Christ for you.

I actually agree with you Egor in that the gospels are interwoven with symbolism, allegory, secret wisdom and even riddles, as well as even stranger stuff like isopsephia. My problem would be that it is Christians like you lack the vision to see this, not atheists. You misinterpret allegorical myths as literal history and then base you life on them.

To quote you above 'to just take them on the surface so concretely would only lead to destruction'...

[Guardian85]

The Gospels are so deeply interwoven with symbolism, allegory, secret wisdom and even riddles meant to be figured out that to just take them on the surface so concretely would only lead to destruction.

I have a feeling anyone who wished to could take any book in the world -- Bambi, for instance -- and make the same claim.

And don't even get me started on Star Wars or Lord of the Rings.  

[Sandra Craft]

The Gospels are so deeply interwoven with symbolism, allegory, secret wisdom and even riddles meant to be figured out that to just take them on the surface so concretely would only lead to destruction.

I have a feeling anyone who wished to could take any book in the world -- Bambi, for instance -- and make the same claim.

And don't even get me started on Star Wars or Lord of the Rings.  

That obsession takes me back to my high school days.  *shudder*

[Gawen]

Wait a minute; if Gawen's writings require interpretation...

I thought what I wrote was rather straight forward. Or is it that you are so consumed by symbolism, allegory and defining secret wisdom that you cannot understand what I say...

It is great that you are around Gawen so that we can ask you for clarification. Otherwise I am sure we would get it wrong.
Imagine if our eternal happiness or damnation was based on getting it right and if you couldn't be bothered to clarify, we'd be up shit creek.

Don't you know it!...*chucklin*.  And I don't claim that I'm perfect either. Can you imagine what life would be like if, say,  the medical field claimed itself to be perfect and all the text books were written in allegory, symbolism and secret wisdom? And all the medical instructors, knowing they are perfect talked to their med students in parables and metaphor? And the surgeon general utters wisdom revealed such as, when they find a barren woman she must be killed because she can bare no fruit...or eat anything you want, washed or unwashed, because it's clean going in. And then one day, through badly mistaken altruism all the instructors and doctors voluntarily hang themselves to save everyone from every malady? But 2000 years later everyone still gets sick? Perfect...hogwash.

[hackenslash]

It wasn't all that different for a long time. Much of what was taken to be medical knowledge constituted 'revealed wisdom' for a very long time. The work of Galen was taken to be sacrosanct, despite the fact that dissections were being carried out that demonstrated that much of what he said was wrong. His work was taught to all students at the University of Basel (among other centres of learning) until the arrival of Paracelsus, who challenged Galenic medicine and began to put it on a sound empirical footing, moving away from the doctrine of 'humors' and beginning to apply chemistry to medicine for the first time.

Of course, much of what Paracelsus said was also nonsense, but it started the ball rolling toward a more empirical approach to medicine.