Theists, how do you explain natural evil and bad design?

[Heisenberg]

It is very logical if you treat the bible as equally fictitious as other storybooks, whish is one of the preqisites for being a non-believer.
Unless you are willing to use special reasoning to give the bible a free pass from objective truth value, it has no more status then any other work of fiction.

So lessons cannot be learned from stories if they contain anything immoral...

No they can, one just can't claim to draw all of his morals from a book that he cherry picks stories from. If you do that, then obviously you are relying on knowledge (morals) you picked up elsewhere, so clearly they didn't all come from the bible.

I guess you can say there are good morals one can draw from the bible, but I'd say just about any book you pick up has some good moral lessons so again, the bible is not 'morally special' over all, or most, other books at all.

[AnimatedDirt]

It is very logical if you treat the bible as equally fictitious as other storybooks, whish is one of the preqisites for being a non-believer.
Unless you are willing to use special reasoning to give the bible a free pass from objective truth value, it has no more status then any other work of fiction.

So lessons cannot be learned from stories if they contain anything immoral...

No they can, one just can't claim to draw all of his morals from a book that he cherry picks stories from. If you do that, then obviously you are relying on knowledge (morals) you picked up elsewhere, so clearly they didn't all come from the bible.

Cherry pick?  I'm not sure I understand.  I will say, though, that some "stories" might be in there simply for the historical facts (or facts as a believer would believe, I don't assume you take them as historical facts...but in context) and not necessarily to promote a certain style of life above or below another. 

I guess you can say there are good morals one can draw from the bible, but I'd say just about any book you pick up has some good moral lessons so again, the bible is not 'morally special' over all, or most, other books at all.

No, I wouldn't argue this point.

[Guardian85]

I guess you can say there are good morals one can draw from the bible, but I'd say just about any book you pick up has some good moral lessons so again, the bible is not 'morally special' over all, or most, other books at all.

No, I wouldn't argue this point.

And you blanket dismiss this argument because?

[Sweetdeath]

Nah... In general, lessons can only be learned well from experience.

Which does not invalidate that lessons can be learned from stories.

Reading about the loss of a loved one in a story  is one thing. Losing one in real life is another.
I believe real lessons come from real life and personal experiences.

[The Magic Pudding]

Nah... In general, lessons can only be learned well from experience.

Which does not invalidate that lessons can be learned from stories.

I think lessons can be learned from stories.
There's all those truly great social injustice stories I grew up with.
I didn't learn empathy for a rape victim from a real person, it was from stories.
I've never lived under a totalitarian regime but stories have taught me the danger of them.
The example of those who battle adversity and succeed is worthwhile, aspiration can be noble.
Stories are an experience for me, often more influential than mundane day to day experience.

[Stevil]

Nah... In general, lessons can only be learned well from experience.

Which does not invalidate that lessons can be learned from stories.

I think lessons can be learned from stories.
There's all those truly great social injustice stories I grew up with.
I didn't learn empathy for a rape victim from a real person, it was from stories.
I've never lived under a totalitarian regime but stories have taught me the danger of them.
The example of those who battle adversity and succeed is worthwhile, aspiration can be noble.
Stories are an experience for me, often more influential than mundane day to day experience.

They have limitations, you can never really know until you are in that situation but they can help one's imagination.
In my opinion the best stories don't tell you what to think, they merely bring up scenarios for you to think about, also the really good ones show you how conflicting both sides of the story can be, ones where you empathise with both sides and understand how conflict arises between two sides who genuinely and passionately are following what they believe to be right.
Stories where it is clear that one side is good and one side is bad do not invoke a willingness to understand your adversary and to compromise or to cohabitate peacefully. Good and bad leads to war!