Resurrection

[DirtyLeo]

How many more millions of years would you think it will take for evolution to teach the moth the difference between good light and a suicide?

I don't think that, given this example, fire is a true selective pressure. I'm sure the number of moths killed by the death spiral is negligible compared to the entire moth population.

How long would it take for humans to learn masturbation doesn't make babies?  

[Stevil]

How many more millions of years would you think it will take for evolution to teach the moth the difference between good light and a suicide?

It most certainly would happen. Humans have been making fire for only a few thousand years, light bulbs for much less time. The ecology has not had much time to evolve and adapt with regards to the influence of humans.

[AnimatedDirt]

How many more millions of years would you think it will take for evolution to teach the moth the difference between good light and a suicide?

It most certainly would happen. Humans have been making fire for only a few thousand years, light bulbs for much less time. The ecology has not had much time to evolve and adapt with regards to the influence of humans.

And so fire has only been around since humans started making it?  I think it's my turn to do a facepalm.  

[Stevil]

And so fire has only been around since humans started making it?  I think it's my turn to do a facepalm.  

I don't think I have ever done a facepalm to you or anyone for that matter. I guess you are learning some habits from others on this site.
Fires in nature tend to be quite catastrophic, burn everything down, kill everything and also tend to be sporadic.
Man made fires tend to be controlled and frequent. The type that living creatures can survive, learn from, adapt from, the type that individuals with a tendency for avoidance can avoid.

[DirtyLeo]

@AnimatedDirt

We are capable of altering the nature around us quite drastically and abruptly, which has devastating effects for the other living beings around us as our existence is just a blink compared to their evolutionary lifetime. If fire were a true evolutionary pressure moths would either go extinct or would evolve in order to survive. If, hypothetically, fire were one of moth's predators, they would have evolved together with tiny steps which is very different than the brusque changes that we introduce into our ecosystem.

[AnimatedDirt]

And so fire has only been around since humans started making it?  I think it's my turn to do a facepalm.  

I don't think I have ever done a facepalm to you or anyone for that matter. I guess you are learning some habits from others on this site.
Fires in nature tend to be quite catastrophic, burn everything down, kill everything and also tend to be sporadic.
Man made fires tend to be controlled and frequent. The type that living creatures can survive, learn from, adapt from, the type that individuals with a tendency for avoidance can avoid.

The facepalm was directed at the many excuses given for the moth to not already have figured it out.  Fire is destructive at the catastrophic level and at the one flame level.  To a moth, a flame is quite large and flying into it causes catastrophic damage...mostly death.

Back to the topic of Predestination/freewill.