Preaching the Gospel of Fire & Brimstone

[jamesatracy]

Today on my college campus there was a small group of Christian preachers, well, preaching to students passing by. By the time my friend and I approached them there was already a decent crowd formed around them - mostly people just standing there and listening. Neither my friend nor I like to pass up the opportunity to challenge campus preachers (these were not college students), so we walked right up to them. The school LGBT (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgendered) club was promoting itself on the main drag and this seems to be what had attracted the preachers there, whom I had never seen before. They were railing against homosexuality as an abominable sin against God and chastising those in the crowd for being sinners and not obeying God’s law. For this, of course, we would all go to hell.

My friend and a few others in the crowd tried to challenge them on a number of points, but they were experts at talking fast and diverting questions. My friend challenged him to explain why he rejects the Qur’an as the inspired word of God in favor of the Bible, even though both claim and are both claimed to be inspired. He said, in effect, that the Qur’an advocates killing non-Muslims, so it cannot come from the One True Benevolent God. Of course, when God in the Old Testament sanctioned the killing of entire nations of people, let alone drowning most of the world in a global flood Himself, these were OK. Why? Because death is just a period of sleep until the final judgment and resurrection.

The next tactic that my friend attempted was to challenge the preacher to produce a sign of God’s existence. For example, Mark 16:17-18 says, “And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.” So my friend asked the preacher if he would drink a ‘deadly thing,’ like say, Chlorox. The preacher essentially agreed with the scripture- drinking poison, he claimed, would not actually hurt him! Of course, he wouldn’t actually do it. To do it intentionally would be to test God, in which case it wouldn’t work. In fact, asking for any sign would be a test of faith so God won’t do it (see also John 14:14, “If in my name you ask me* for anything, I will do it”). How convenient! The Creator of the Universe will not show a convincing sigh of His existence because, apparently, it is preferable to believe without sufficient evidence.

Overall, it was more fire and brimstone than I had ever seen before and was an especially interesting contrast to the “God is love, God loves you” speeches that I usually hear on campus. In fact, a Christian came up to me and told me that he was embarrassed to see other Christians acting in that manner. I asked this person, an undergraduate student, whether or not he believed that a good person who happened to be an atheist deserves eternal hell for not believing in God or a miracle that purportedly happened 2,000 years ago. He hesitantly agreed, but added that he was not 100% sure what God’s criteria are for sending people to heaven or hell. This seemed unsettling to him, as it should be. After all, if our eternal lives depend on meeting a certain criteria shouldn’t that criteria be made explicit by God?

As they were leaving, one of the preachers came up to me and I asked him why I should believe that the Bible in his hand is the divine word of God. This wasn’t really what he wanted to talk about, however. He offered some unusual remarks, including that the Jewish historian Josephus and the 3rd century Church historian Eusebius both testified to Jesus’ resurrection. Then he asked me if I have ever told a lie. Of course, I said. He told me that by lying I was transgressing God’s law and would burn in hell for an eternity. I tried to explain to him that I was not perfect but considered myself to be a decent person. Unfortunately, this person was more interested in mindlessly preaching to me the same canned statements and verses rather than having an actual conversation. At one point he actually claimed that he was morally perfect now that he had found the gospel. It was frustrating and unfortunate.

I agree with my friend’s conclusion: as impossible as it was to try and debate with these people, it nevertheless benefited at least some of the people standing by in the crowd who were listening in.

Have you had any interesting experiences with street preachers? Christians in public places trying to convert you?

[SteveS]

Hey james,

Then he asked me if I have ever told a lie. Of course, I said. He told me that by lying I was transgressing God’s law and would burn in hell for an eternity. I tried to explain to him that I was not perfect but considered myself to be a decent person. Unfortunately, this person was more interested in mindlessly preaching to me the same canned statements and verses rather than having an actual conversation.

This sounds like the old Ray Comfort/Kirk Cameron approach.  These "preachers" must have been fans of their show....

I agree with my friend’s conclusion: as impossible as it was to try and debate with these people, it nevertheless benefited at least some of the people standing by in the crowd who were listening in.

This is an interesting observation --- maybe these efforts aren't actually fruitless after all.

Keep up the good work!

[jamesatracy]

SteveS wrote:
maybe these efforts aren't actually fruitless after all.

Exactly. I said to my friend while he was debating the preacher, "You're not getting through to him. It's like talking to a wall." He replied, "I know. I am doing it for everybody else."

Consequently, a couple of Christians from within the crowd, who were far more open to hearing what we had to say, approached us later.

[SteveS]

This is a really interesting topic to me, james.  I haven't gone in much for public debate, but I wonder if there isn't a kind of strategy you could develop, sort of "steal the spotlight" from the preacher by appealing to the crowd.  Turn to them and say something like "did that sound like an answer to any of you?  Because I don't think he answered my question".  That sort of thing.  Maybe, maybe not, I'm not there so I can't really judge, but your approach is interesting and your results seem real.

Anyway, I find this fascinating.  If you guys have any more encounters of this nature, please come back and share your results.  I'm curious as all get-out!

Best of luck,
Steve

[jamesatracy]

Steve,

My friend, who has a far more commanding presence than I do, tried this a few times. It garnered some good reactions. At one point, when the preacher cut him off without answering the question, he tried standing on the ledge next to the guy and "counter-preaching." The problem with this was that their voices began competing with one another. The preacher was very skilled and never really got thrown off of his game.

They were out again this afternoon but unfortunately I was only passing through on my way to class. I did notice, however, that, despite there being an even larger group listening, nobody was speaking out against the preacher. What I found interesting the other day was that, once my friend and I vocally challenged the preacher, a few other people actually joined in as well.

Anyway, it was an interesting experience and I think the strategy you described has some good potential based on that one encounter.

[SteveS]

Interesting stuff.  It sorts of makes sense that once a person of sufficient self-confidence speaks out others will be more likely to do so.  There's probably a lot of "closet" doubters among the crowd.

My favorite moment of this type from college was when the local preacher-guy (we called him "Mad Max" down at Illinois - the UC campus) was going on about the evils of sex.  A friend and I stopped briefly to listen with bemusement, and the guy kept saying "you will burn for your fornication".  Well, one dude shouted out "the only burns I'm getting from my fornication is rug burns!"  Hilarious!  The whole crowd cracked up.

Honestly, this guy was scary.  One of his favorite topics was homosexuality.  I remember him saying that he wanted to form a "homo-patrol" in each town, staffed with volunteers, who would identify the homosexuals and collect their names and addresses.  What he was planning to do next I don't know, but this was getting alarming.  I didn't see it myself, but there was a rumor that he was actually arrested later for a speech that proposed people should kill the homosexuals.  I guess this is just one of the reasons they called him "Mad" (sort of works with both meanings of the word    ).

[jamesatracy]

I have to take back my statement that the preacher "never really got thrown off his game." He did at one point. While my friend was asking the preacher for a sign of God's existence, the preacher said, "A generation seeks after a sign, but none shall be given except 3 days and 3 nights ..." My friend then proceeded to count off how many days and night Jesus was in the tomb: Friday and Friday night , Saturday and Saturday night, and Sunday (3 days and 2 nights). He said that he would have to study that one...

[SteveS]

Haha!  Nice.

[myleviathan]

Well, one dude shouted out "the only burns I'm getting from my fornication is rug burns!"

That's just awesome.