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Death: An Atheist's Perspective

Started by Whitney, September 20, 2010, 02:11:17 AM

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aerie

I had a very close cousin who killed himself (after he became an atheist). He had a 20yr long battle w/ bipolar disorder w/ severe depression that left him nearly bedridden, he never responded well to treatments & had basically lost everything (he was mid 40s); his wife, his career, his beloved 2-seater airplane, his pilot's license & his dignity. While I never discussed it w/ him, I contend that it was only after gaining an atheistic, liberating view of death that he was able to finally end his lifetime of suffering. He methodically planned his death for 6mos prior to a date he had circled on the calendar w/a smiley face, April 23 (we found his detailed plans/notes on his computer). He was able to get his affairs in order, write letters to family & friends, say his goodbyes (unbeknownst to us), find a home for his beloved cat, right down to writing apology notes to EMS, Fire, Police (he was sorry they had to see the gore & drama or that it would disturb or inconvenience them) that he nailed to the tree above his body w/info on who they should contact (he used a shotgun). His writings conveyed a sense of relief. He knew that oblivion would end his pain & he need not worry about a god or eternal punishment, just sweet nothingness.

Not trying to romanticize suicide, his or anyone's, but I clearly get it. His was a terminal cancer of the mind, he had every right to say "enough!" I detest the judgements survivors make that he "took the easy way out" or he was "only thinking of himself". Nonsense. We don't have the right to expect someone to endure unrelenting, unbearable pain for the sake of our own comfort or tears. For some, suicide *is* often a snap decision before even seeking help, that's truly tragic & maybe that's selfish, idk; but for many that's NOT the case. Either way, it's their choice. Of course survivors will grieve, as we did. But mostly I'm glad he's resting in peace...er, oblivion. But, the xtians in my family said he did it because he "hated god", was "spiritually & morally empty" & had nothing to live after turning his back on god (as if jaysus had offered him so much peace, hope or relief as a believer, ever).   :upset:
Xtian marriage & parenting:
"...marriage and parenting sanctify you like no other...i want to saturate M and T's life with Jesus so that the see Him in tractors, disney movies, Trix, in the color pink, in dinosaurs, in mommy and daddy...and so on...."     ~billythebeliever (FSTDT)

Asmodean

Quote from: "aerie"I detest the judgements survivors make that he "took the easy way out" or he was "only thinking of himself". Nonsense.
:raised:
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

tunghaichuan

Quote from: "Asmodean"
Quote from: "aerie"I detest the judgements survivors make that he "took the easy way out" or he was "only thinking of himself". Nonsense.
:raised:

I agree. I remember reading a column by Dan Savage, a gay sex advice columnist. He basically said the idea that "God never gives us more than we can handle" is utter bullshit. His reasoning was that people kill themselves every day because life dumps more on them than they can handle.
The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt.
- Bertrand Russell

In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Horatio G. Spafford, March 17,

Cycel

Quote from: "Whitney"I thought it would be appropriate to start a thread where people can share their perspective on death, how to cope with the finality of death, and thoughts on dying.  These are issues that many atheists have to work through....
I have no fear of death, but must confess that from the time I became an atheist (or earlier) and up till age 21 I believed in the existence of an afterlife.  I think that may have been a way of coping, or it may have been a hold-over from my religious days, or it may have been a simple interest in things mysterious.

Quote from: "Whitney"My perspective is fairly simply that I won't be around to worry about being dead after I am dead so there is no sense worrying about it now...
I have talked with atheists who acknowledged experiencing a fear of Hell.  What if, after all, they were mistaken?  It's one thing to toss belief in God aside, but there is that nagging fear of Hell, that for some, won't quite go away.  I experienced that trepidation myself till age 16, no longer, but for some that fear persists.

Quote from: "Whitney"I also think that religion thrives as much as it does because people want to hear that there is an afterlife rather than dealing with a finite existence.
You may well be right; but religion also seems to give people's lives meaning.  The religious often stress that atheists' lives are without purpose.  Do they mean without immortality?

Cycel

Quote from: "Tank"I won't be aware of being dead so the condition is irrelevent.
It's the getting there that's the concern.

Tank

Quote from: "Cycel"
Quote from: "Tank"I won't be aware of being dead so the condition is irrelevent.
It's the getting there that's the concern.
Of course, that has always been the problem.  :D
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
"Religion is a culture of faith; science is a culture of doubt." ― Richard P. Feynman
'It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die. That is true, it's called Life.' - Terry Pratchett
Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.

Asmodean

Quote from: "Tank"Of course, that has always been the problem.  :D I believe that stuff blows up pretty fast. A quick way to go, yes?  :pop:
Quote from: Ecurb Noselrub on July 25, 2013, 08:18:52 PM
In Asmo's grey lump,
wrath and dark clouds gather force.
Luxembourg trembles.

Thumpalumpacus

Yeah, I always figured an airplane crash would be a good way to go, and the worst to my mind has got to be a toss-up between burning and drowning.
Illegitimi non carborundum.

notself

The best way to go would be any way that was painless.  The worst way to go would be congestive heart failure which is nothing but a slow form of suffocation.  I turned down chemo because the one the doctors would have used had a side effect which was an 11% chance of irreversible congestive heart failure.  Nasty stuff.

Tank

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"Yeah, I always figured an airplane crash would be a good way to go, and the worst to my mind has got to be a toss-up between burning and drowning.
So crashing into the sea in a burning aircraft would be sort of a half way ideal then?
If religions were TV channels atheism is turning the TV off.
"Religion is a culture of faith; science is a culture of doubt." ― Richard P. Feynman
'It is said that your life flashes before your eyes just before you die. That is true, it's called Life.' - Terry Pratchett
Remember, your inability to grasp science is not a valid argument against it.

tunghaichuan

Another good way to go would be a narcotics overdose; floating away in a beautiful dream.

I tell my wife I want to go by being shot by a jealous husband, but oddly enough, she doesn't seem to think that is funny.  lol
The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt.
- Bertrand Russell

In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Horatio G. Spafford, March 17,

Islador

My perspective on death is fairly straight foward. Once my brain/biochemistry structure is sufficiently degraded that I am no longer recognisable as me by those who are closest to me I am dead, even if my body is still walking and talking.

I do not believe that I have a soul because there is no reason to believe that my conciouness arises from outside my body. With so many people suffering from mental health problems as a result of degredation or damage to their brain I think that we can be fairly certain that our conciousness arises from the brain and the chemical environment in which it exists.

Thumpalumpacus

Quote from: "Tank"
Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"Yeah, I always figured an airplane crash would be a good way to go, and the worst to my mind has got to be a toss-up between burning and drowning.
So crashing into the sea in a burning aircraft would be sort of a half way ideal then?

Looks like I'm getting the shit-end of the stick there, either way.
Illegitimi non carborundum.

NoodleCup

I've actually thought about this quite a bit and have come to a conclusion that puts me at ease. I believe death brings oblivion and that one cannot care about being dead in death so why fear it? It's a sort of release.

One cannot experience everything life has to offer in one lifetime, this is fact. There are just to many things that can be done and most don't have the resources to try everything. Questioning death always brings the whole "Purpose to life" question up for me, what I mean is, if death is a release and life is full of shit than what is the point? Well, there are the good parts and the bad parts. I believe the whole point is to avoid the crappy parts and strive for the good ones.

What are the good parts some people ask? Well I think that is up to the individual. For me it's knowledge, I learn small bits and pieces wherever I can find them no matter how trivial. New thoughts, new ideas whatever peeks my interest at any given point. I find myself watching shows like 'How it's made.' on the science channel not because I may find some use for it some day but just because it's there.

I find life and all it's small bits fascinating and my only regret, if I were ever to have any in my moment of death, is not being able to experience everything.

QuoteIt's a liberating thought that everything ends. If someone offered me perpetual existance, I'd kill myself.

I'd accept it if I could end it at any given moment. More time to experience and learn new things? I would welcome it.

I suppose one could ask what the point was if everything were to be lost or forgotten. That would lead to there being no point at all. Maybe the point is just to enjoy it? Then why not enjoy as much as you can?
I know what I am, I am what I know.

Stevil

To some degree I don't fear death. But if I were in a life threatening situation then I know I would be fearful. I want to live. Life is precious and is worth living for.
I do fear the death of my wife or children. I don't know how I would cope if one of them died.
I hope I die before any of them, but hopefully that is a long time from now.

Would I have regrets before I died? Certainly not with regards to not having done certain life activities e.g. skydiving, scuba diving etc. I mean, when you are dying these things likely don't matter. They are fun things to pass the time while you are around but ultimately of no importance.
I might regret things like not telling my wife I love her often enough, or not being the best parent for my children. But then again I am trying to be the best I can in that regard so hopefully I will have nothing to regret. Who knows what the future holds?