Happy Atheist Forum

I am new to atheism, and my story is probably not that unusual, but I want to hear how some of you came to atheism.
I was once a hardcore conservative christian, studied the bible often, but last year I began to have some thoughts about the religion, what it means, promotes, the values it holds important and things of that nature. I began to question how a loving, compassionate god could justify, and in some cases order his followers to commit genocide, how any loving, compassionate god could allow, in modern times, extremist groups to continue to commit genocide because people don't follow the extremist's religion (as they see it) to a T, instead of just showing himself and ordering them to stop or proving their religion wrong (depending on the religion and god). I wondered why a loving, compassionate god would want homosexuals to be killed for something they have no choice in, or why a loving, compassionate god would want women to be killed because they weren't virgins on their wedding day, or how any of these things that didn't even really need to be justified could be by this loving, compassionate god more or less murdering his hybrid human/god son. Things like this began to cease to make sense once I started to form my own political thoughts and ideas and after a while I just decided that there could be no such thing as a loving, compassionate god.

Well, I never converted. I was born an atheist (just like everyone else) and never believed any of it...even through the first 17 years of my life as a Presbyterian. There are some interesting stories here, though.

I don't think anyone in my close family has ever really believed in god. But I did go to synagogue as a kid (reform judaism) and got bar mitzvah'd, so the religion was still in my life, just more as a cultural thing than anyone else. Once I went to college, I stopped going to any religious services, partly because I couldn't justify sitting there and listening to the rabbi talk about god. I felt like a hypocrite, and gradually felt more comfortable calling myself agnostic or atheist. I'm also very political, and seeing politicians invoke religion so often bothered me very much.
I can't say I've stopped being jewish either, I suppose. It's part of my background, but at this point it has absolutely no influence or connection to my life. And if we ever have kids, we've agreed we're not raising them in either one of our religions.

I posted a bit of it in my introduction topic just a couple of nights ago, but... First, there was the foundation of me never feeling too strongly for Christianity. I went to church every Sunday throughout all of my childhood. However, I found it extremely boring and praise and worship did nothing for me. People who are real Christians speak so differently of Christianity, God, and Jesus than I ever have.

So that's the foundation. However, I wasn't actively questioning the existence of said God. I hadn't really been introduced to the concept, sadly. My family is so Christian. They absolutely want me to marry a 'good person'. Meaning a Christian (directly stated by them). *sighs* Anyway, in late summer of 2004 I got my own PC, and my family got high speed internet. I joined two forums that had an really outspoken atheist member. He wasn't rude about it, but he was a very smart guy and made great arguments (introducing me to arguments as to why the Christian God is so unlikely to actually exist). Eventually, it got through to me. I don't want to make it seem like I was influenced to become an Atheist by some random guy on the internet, but as I said, the foundation was there. And it didn't come quick. Around that time I also took AP European History, and hearing about all of the history of the church also tipped me toward the atheist side. Lastly, being passionately for the rights and acceptance of AND being a part of the LGBT community tipped me completely over to atheism.

So there were a few influences. Overall, atheism just felt so right to me. Like it is the real truth. With the concept of how unlikely God is and the history of how Christianity was used, it just become undeniable to me that something is up.

As said in my introduction topic, I've had a time of weakness. Not as in being a Christian is weak, but as in I wanted to go back to believing in God due to my own weakness to cope with issues that came into my life. I went with that for four years before I finally came back to admitting what I knew was true deep down. God is so unlikely, and I can't rely on things like "Satan planted this to fool you" and "God is so far above our comprehension. You and I could never prove his existence with our inferior intelligence (not even joking, that has been said)" to hold up faith in something that is so unlikely.

my whole story is on here somewhere...assuming it wasn't lost during our last database transfer....but, in short, my search to find a deeper understanding of the bible brought about unexpected results.  Then I was deist and 'agnostic' for some time till I felt atheist was the best label for my views.

Quote from: Radiant on January 27, 2012, 05:13:13 AM

Around that time I also took AP European History, and hearing about all of the history of the church also tipped me toward the atheist side. Lastly, being passionately for the rights and acceptance of AND being a part of the LGBT community tipped me completely over to atheism.

AP Euro was also my first eye-opener.  It was when I realized that as a Catholic I was actually supposed to believe the cracker became flesh, and that it wasn't all just symbolic.  That was the first step.

Oh and not really related to the topic at all but I always get excited when I see female members joining (partly because most of the outspoken atheists are male and there is little representation from the female side) but mostly because on a Lutheran campus like where I am I haven't met a single girl who isn't outspokenly Christian yet and let's face it, I'm gettin' lonely over here.  The only reason I bring this up is because I lol'd when I read that you identify with the LGBT community and I was like "well, easy come, easy go". 

Quote from: Whitney on January 27, 2012, 06:09:48 AM
my whole story is on here somewhere...assuming it wasn't lost during our last database transfer....but, in short, my search to find a deeper understanding of the bible brought about unexpected results.  Then I was deist and 'agnostic' for some time till I felt atheist was the best label for my views.

That wasn't to hard to find  ;)

Quote from: Whitney on July 10, 2006, 10:17:11 AM
I figured this is a good as place as any to introduce myself by explaining why I'm an atheist.  I haven't written it all out yet, so here is my story up to when I officially became agnostic, call it part one or whatever:

I was raised as a christian...believed it blindly (like a child till I was in my pre-teens).  Then became what is referred to in some denominations as born again (I grew up presbyterian and they didn't use that term).  I accepted god with all my heart and felt we had a relationship...I was somewhat of an evangelical but not a fundamentalist.  I believed that God used evolution to create all the life we see today.  I did however think the flood story was probably true, but mainly because I had no reason to think otherwise at that time...true or not, I saw it as a story of god's loving forgiveness and how he gave us a second chance.

That made sense to me for a while, I was able to look over anything bad in the bible because 1) I hadn't really read much of it and 2) I viewed most of the bible as stories which were written to teach a lesson, even if I currently didn't understand the lesson.  I started to view it as my christian duty to actually read the bible because doing so would allow me to bring more people to god.  The more I read the less I started to view the bible as a holy text.  My thoughts towards christianity changed from it being the one true religion to that maybe all religions were correct.  I remained a chrsitian because it worked for me but quit worrying about if others believed the same.  I started viewing jesus more as a symbolic teacher than a savior...although I couldn't have put that into words at the time.  At this point I thought about converting to Judaism but knew that was a very time consuming process and decided god wouldn't care what religion I was anyway.

My pluralistic view of religion led to me not being that concerned about going to church anymore as an obligation to god...I continued going because I like to participate in choir and had some friends there.  My childhood church started breaking up over a monetary dispute (old people wanted to keep the building for sentimental reasons even though it was falling apart, the younger crowd wanted to sell it and build a new building).  I tried joining one of my classmate's churches but soon found my friends at that church were only my friends in church....so the appeal of going to church soon wore off and I quit going.  I was about to go off to college anyway.

So, I get to college.  Well, I forgot to explain what brought me to a pluralistic view of religion...so I'll explain here rather than going back and editing.  At some point I realized that there are a lot more religions in the world other than christians and that each of those religions had people who believed just as deeply and behaved just as morally as christians.  Seeing all these good people, I couldn't imagine a loving god sending them to hell just for not following a particular religion.  So, I decided that all religions, weird to me or not, must be valid paths.  So, back to being in college...I didn't think that much about religion for a couple years.  My current bf and I would have the occasional late night chat centering around if there isn't a god how could anything exist.  Through remembering our discussions I realize that's when I started becoming agnostic.  During those times I'd still try to talk to god and seek guidance...maybe more as a way to self-contemplation that seeking divine guidance, after all I knew not to expect a verbal or obvious reply.  I was never one to actually ask god for things anyway, I figured he was too busy trying to help those in more need than I, but I did occasionally ask..didn't pay much attention to if I got an answer or not...prayer had always been somewhat symbolic to me anyway.

Anyway...I had a deep faith in god even though I questioned...I had to have faith...how else could anything be here?  The universe didn't just poof out of thin air.  But then...how did god get there?  These questions puzzled me...so I started searching for an answer.  My search led me to discussing in some christian chat rooms...none of them or other religious people in those rooms had a very good answer other than god always existed.  It's fine to believe that way, but it didn't really answer my question.   Being in those rooms also gave me my first interactions with atheists.  Needless to say, atheist who hang out in christian chat rooms aren't typically very nice so the way I was taught to view atheists was only further enhanced (atheists are mean, immoral etc).  It wasn't until I met my bf and some of his friends that I started to realize that atheists can and often are good people too.  It is important to point out here that my bf never tried to make me an atheist, I only knew his beliefs from my best friend letting me know he was an atheist, we didn't even discuss religion until I had some questions about atheists I wanted him to answer.  The big question was...where did everything come from?  I don't remember him actually giving me an answer, I think he must have realized the importance of me searching on my own.  I also didn't want to start much of a religious discussion with him because I know that can ruin young relationships.

So, I started reading.  I think I may have thumbed through a couple books he had on the shelf (he has a lot being a philosophy major).  I decided to go to the bookstore to see what sort of books I could find dealing with the god question...so when I found "the question of god" it seemed like a good one...it really helped me put my thoughts together on god.  In the book it compared the writings of C.S. Lewis to Freud.  I will say that it's not the best book comparing the two 'sides' I actually didn't agree with a lot either had to say.  What's interesting looking back is that I wrote little notes next to things in the book...what I was thinking.  If anyone is interested I can try to find the book and type some of my notes into the forum.  Anyway, that book is what made me realize that my beliefs had changed to pure agnosticism...I didn't know if god was real or not and saw no way to answer the question.

I guess that gets through explaining mostly why I'm not religious anymore (I'm sure I left some things out).  It doesn't really answer why I'm an atheist now, but I've grown tired of typing....so, to be continued.

Never a theist. No need to de-convert  ;D

Not a convert. Asmos have a natural immunity to religion.

I'm not actually converted yet... lol.

I made an introduction post some months ago and got sidetracked by life, but I'm back and I just want to be apart of a community that is sane. I think that I'm in the agnostic realm but I keep asking myself why I'm scared to just go for it and completely be atheist.

My story is very much like Radiant's in the sense that I grew up with religion and it was apart of my life for a long time - even though since a very young age I've always thought there was something not quite right with it.

It's very hard to un-train myself. To not "thank god", or "pray to god" during times when I need hope. It's just habit. 29 years of habit that I'm trying to unlearn...

Do you really need hope, or do you just want it?

Quote from: Asmodean on January 27, 2012, 10:40:00 AM
Do you really need hope, or do you just want it?

Both I guess. What I'm learning is that I don't need a god figure to get that hope. Hope comes when I naturally apply reason and logic... and it's much, much better than relying on an unknown, magical source.

Quote from: Thunder Road on January 27, 2012, 07:27:11 AM
Oh and not really related to the topic at all but I always get excited when I see female members joining (partly because most of the outspoken atheists are male and there is little representation from the female side) but mostly because on a Lutheran campus like where I am I haven't met a single girl who isn't outspokenly Christian yet and let's face it, I'm gettin' lonely over here.  The only reason I bring this up is because I lol'd when I read that you identify with the LGBT community and I was like "well, easy come, easy go". 

Now what exactly do you mean by that?

Quote from: Radiant on January 27, 2012, 03:11:01 PM

Quote from: Thunder Road on January 27, 2012, 07:27:11 AM
Oh and not really related to the topic at all but I always get excited when I see female members joining (partly because most of the outspoken atheists are male and there is little representation from the female side) but mostly because on a Lutheran campus like where I am I haven't met a single girl who isn't outspokenly Christian yet and let's face it, I'm gettin' lonely over here.  The only reason I bring this up is because I lol'd when I read that you identify with the LGBT community and I was like "well, easy come, easy go". 

Now what exactly do you mean by that?

Let me guess. He liked the idea of a chatting up a girl, only to find out she was a lesbian?  :-[ That's what I took it to mean. Mind you, LGBT does include bi-sexual so he still could be in luck!

Quote from: Tank on January 27, 2012, 03:22:42 PM

Quote from: Radiant on January 27, 2012, 03:11:01 PM

Quote from: Thunder Road on January 27, 2012, 07:27:11 AM
Oh and not really related to the topic at all but I always get excited when I see female members joining (partly because most of the outspoken atheists are male and there is little representation from the female side) but mostly because on a Lutheran campus like where I am I haven't met a single girl who isn't outspokenly Christian yet and let's face it, I'm gettin' lonely over here.  The only reason I bring this up is because I lol'd when I read that you identify with the LGBT community and I was like "well, easy come, easy go".  

Now what exactly do you mean by that?

Let me guess. He liked the idea of a chatting up a girl, only to find out she was a lesbian?  :-[ That's what I took it to mean. Mind you, LGBT does include bi-sexual so he still could be in luck!

Oh, duh! This is probably why I fail at socializing and getting dates.  :-[

But, no, I'm not bisexual. I used to think I was, but you just can't convince yourself that you are something that you simply aren't.

Quote from: Radiant on January 27, 2012, 03:41:30 PM
But, no, I'm not bisexual. I used to think I was, but you just can't convince yourself that you are something that you simply aren't.

*redneck hat on*

That blue pony. It's obviously gay. It's going to Hell, where it shall be penetrated by that rainbow-thing for all eternity.  >:(


*/hat*  ;D

I've never believed in any gods. I'm a second generation non-believer. My father was a Catholic until, as a young boy, he was told that he couldn't read particular books. As a very intelligent young person, this didn't sit well with him, and he felt that any religion that couldn't stand up to differing thoughts was full of it. He never looked back. My mom was raised Lutheran. She had a similar response when everyone told her she couldn't ask questions about god or the bible. I'm now in my 50s, and what I have seen throughout my life is that my parents are/were (my dad's dead) some of the smartest, kindest, most ethical people I have ever met. They seem to have their act together far more than their religious sisters and brothers and parents. And their ethics always seemed of the highest order. Protecting the planet, helping people in need, etc. Very giving people.

So, with that example in hand, and with no evidence appearing whatsoever that a god might exist, I never saw any reason to change my views on god and religion. We now have a third generation of non-believers, in my brother's children. They're in college now, and nicer, cooler, smarter kids would be hard to find. I can't help contrast that with extended family members who are still religious: many instances of teen pregnancies, drug use, suicidal tendencies, and many other problems.

Quote from: Radiant on January 27, 2012, 03:41:30 PM

Quote from: Tank on January 27, 2012, 03:22:42 PM

Quote from: Radiant on January 27, 2012, 03:11:01 PM

Quote from: Thunder Road on January 27, 2012, 07:27:11 AM
Oh and not really related to the topic at all but I always get excited when I see female members joining (partly because most of the outspoken atheists are male and there is little representation from the female side) but mostly because on a Lutheran campus like where I am I haven't met a single girl who isn't outspokenly Christian yet and let's face it, I'm gettin' lonely over here.  The only reason I bring this up is because I lol'd when I read that you identify with the LGBT community and I was like "well, easy come, easy go".  

Now what exactly do you mean by that?

Let me guess. He liked the idea of a chatting up a girl, only to find out she was a lesbian?  :-[ That's what I took it to mean. Mind you, LGBT does include bi-sexual so he still could be in luck!

Oh, duh! This is probably why I fail at socializing and getting dates.  :-[

But, no, I'm not bisexual. I used to think I was, but you just can't convince yourself that you are something that you simply aren't.

The other issue is that the written word (as a means of interactive communication) can be awfully ambiguous. I read some research once that came to the conclusion that if you take a face-to-face conversation as 100% communication then the written word only rates 7%! You lose 93% of communication bandwidth on a forum. That's why smilies/emoticons are so important. The main problem with this degraded 'bandwidth' is that people unconsciously fill in the gaps. If a person who you like makes a given statement then you'll put a positive spin on it, while the same statement made by somebody you dislike (or don't know) may get a negative spin. In practice you fill in the gaps of a persona based on your own preconceptions/prejudices/experiences. Forum land is strewn with examples of miss-communication.

I realized I was an atheist (wouldn't say "converted to atheism") mostly as a result of learning more about the scientific explanations for certain things I'd considered to be supernatural and for how the universe and life as they exist today came to exist. After a while, a belief in any supernatural being or force just didn't seem necessary or rational.

It seems important to make a distinction between a person's dissatisfaction with and rejection of his or her religion's teachings and a person's coming to the conclusion that no supernatural being/force exists. While the two often go hand in hand, they're really two different things.

Quote from: Anne D. on January 27, 2012, 04:27:00 PM
I realized I was an atheist (wouldn't say "converted to atheism") mostly as a result of learning more about the scientific explanations for certain things I'd considered to be supernatural and for how the universe and life as they exist today came to exist. After a while, a belief in any supernatural being or force just didn't seem necessary or rational.

It seems important to make a distinction between a person's dissatisfaction with and rejection of his or her religion's teachings and a person's coming to the conclusion that no supernatural being/force exists. While the two often go hand in hand, they're really two different things.

Ooh, I totally relate to the bolded.  To the first bolded, that's exactly how I feel.  I don't think that I converted to atheism, because conversion to me implies some sort of choice.  Like I woke up one day and consciously said "Well that's it!  I'm not going to believe in God any more.  Starting.....now!" 

I don't exactly know how I lost my faith in god.  It went in small ways, I suppose.  When I try to think of when I became an atheist, I fall into this kind of rough time period between 14 and 23.  23 is when I consciously identified myself as an atheist, but about 14 is when I started to question things, and started the very long (for me) process of pulling away from Christianity and then the notion of a god altogether.  It sounds strange, but I don't actually remember specifics about what started the process.  I guess maybe because I've been somewhere on the non-religious scale longer than I was ever religious.  Huh.  I think it was just a general sense of things not making sense to me, stories not seeming plausible.  I remember hearing a bible story about some guy growing feathers and claws (I can't remember who or what he did to piss off god) in Sunday School and actually looking around at my fellow students and thinking "Wait, you guys don't believe that literally happened, do you?  You do???  What????"  And I think it just kind of got to the point where the stories I had been told couldn't hold up under their own weight, you know?  Like the harder I looked at things, the less sense anything made, until the whole concept of a god seemed completely ridiculous.

I also agree with the second bolded.  I dislike some of the teachings of the religion I was raised (such as the persecution of homosexuals) but that's not why I'm an atheist.  It's just that once you start questioning religion and thinking about it critically, you often find things that you dislike as well as the things that you disbelieve.

Quote from: Ali on January 27, 2012, 06:33:47 PM

Quote from: Anne D. on January 27, 2012, 04:27:00 PM
I realized I was an atheist (wouldn't say "converted to atheism") mostly as a result of learning more about the scientific explanations for certain things I'd considered to be supernatural and for how the universe and life as they exist today came to exist. After a while, a belief in any supernatural being or force just didn't seem necessary or rational.

It seems important to make a distinction between a person's dissatisfaction with and rejection of his or her religion's teachings and a person's coming to the conclusion that no supernatural being/force exists. While the two often go hand in hand, they're really two different things.

Ooh, I totally relate to the bolded. To the first bolded, that's exactly how I feel.  I don't think that I converted to atheism, because conversion to me implies some sort of choice.  Like I woke up one day and consciously said "Well that's it!  I'm not going to believe in God any more.  Starting.....now!" 

Yes, definitely that, and also, to me, "convert to atheism" implies that atheism is a religion, and it irks me when people do that.

Quote from: Ali on January 27, 2012, 06:33:47 PM

I don't exactly know how I lost my faith in god.  It went in small ways, I suppose.  When I try to think of when I became an atheist, I fall into this kind of rough time period between 14 and 23.  23 is when I consciously identified myself as an atheist, but about 14 is when I started to question things, and started the very long (for me) process of pulling away from Christianity and then the notion of a god altogether.

These are the two things (1 - discarding belief in the teachings of and explanations provided by a particular faith and 2 -coming to the conclusion that no supernatural force exists) that I was trying to distinguish between, just b/c for me they were separate processes. (Discarded my belief in the teachings of the religion I was brought up in beginning as a teenager, but didn't lose my belief in some fuzzy supernatural benevolent force till a good ten+ years later.)

Like I said in the first post, I am new to atheism. I know almost nothing about it. I used the word "conversion" because I thought it fit, but apparently it doesn't.

EDIT: this should probably be moved to life as an atheist.

Count me as another who didn't convert so much as realized I was an atheist.  I was raised around a number of conventional, and unconventional, Xtian religions (depending on how you view Mormonism) and liked them well enough except that they didn't make much sense.  The older I got, the more that bothered me so I decided to read the bible cover to cover as that was the recommended answerer of all questions.  I like to joke that I started Genesis a Xtian and finished Revelations an atheist, but in fact reading the bible only put an end to my Xtianity (which probably wasn't all that strong to begin with).  A few years of general religious searching later and it finally dawned on me that the reason nothing was taking was that I didn't believe in the god any of these religions promoted, and I really couldn't see the likelihood of any god at all.  The universe just made more sense without one.

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on January 28, 2012, 03:08:52 AM
Like I said in the first post, I am new to atheism. I know almost nothing about it. I used the word "conversion" because I thought it fit, but apparently it doesn't.

EDIT: this should probably be moved to life as an atheist.

I'm sorry--I didn't at all mean to sound huffy or harsh.  :) It's hard to communicate tone on the Internet. This topic (how one came to be an atheist) is a great one for discussion, however you choose to frame it.

Quote from: Tank on January 27, 2012, 03:22:42 PM

Let me guess. He liked the idea of a chatting up a girl, only to find out she was a lesbian?  :-[

haha yup.  How's that HAF Dating Site coming along, Tank?  ;)

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on January 28, 2012, 03:08:52 AM
Like I said in the first post, I am new to atheism. I know almost nothing about it. I used the word "conversion" because I thought it fit, but apparently it doesn't.

EDIT: this should probably be moved to life as an atheist.

I think you started this when you had 9 posts so I left it in the LBL. I'll move it now.

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx
I was once a hardcore conservative christian

when to a blind man the sight comes back, he does not convert to binocular vision, rather the ability in restored.

We all are born and able, supposed to get along without any fucking "jericho trumpet" interventions

If you were once a hardcore junkie that now sobered up and cleared out, I would treat you with more respect, as I  would know that some permanent biochemical alterations have taken place and compromise thereafter your morality to intense rigidity and self-purgatory stoic hardline black and white fixation. what is commonly called "once a junkie always a junkie" not however with the same junk.

hence beware considering the rational correspondant society that atheism implies,  a conversion into a different coloured coat, some may see it as an insult, albeit a shallow and low-impact one.

consider everything you learned in the bible as a crime against humanity, and the people who support it, dodgy

Quote from: pytheas on January 28, 2012, 05:57:09 PM

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx
I was once a hardcore conservative christian

when to a blind man the sight comes back, he does not convert to binocular vision, rather the ability in restored.

We all are born and able, supposed to get along without any fucking "jericho trumpet" interventions

If you were once a hardcore junkie that now sobered up and cleared out, I would treat you with more respect, as I  would know that some permanent biochemical alterations have taken place and compromise thereafter your morality to intense rigidity and self-purgatory stoic hardline black and white fixation. what is commonly called "once a junkie always a junkie" not however with the same junk.

hence beware considering the rational correspondant society that atheism implies,  a conversion into a different coloured coat, some may see it as an insult, albeit a shallow and low-impact one.

consider everything you learned in the bible as a crime against humanity, and the people who support it, dodgy

I hate the person I once was. I was a terrible person. I blindly followed a work of fiction from the bronze age and I regret every day of it. I see the world from a different perspective. There is no justification for the bloodshed and bigotry that the bible, or any other "holy book" has caused. There is no justification for the terrible things I said and the awful messages I spread while a christian. I know what I did was just terrible and if I could take it back I would, but I can't. I hate the ignorant, stupid person I once was and the mistakes I made as him.

Quote from: Asmodean on January 27, 2012, 03:46:55 PM

Quote from: Radiant on January 27, 2012, 03:41:30 PM
But, no, I'm not bisexual. I used to think I was, but you just can't convince yourself that you are something that you simply aren't.

*redneck hat on*

That blue pony. It's obviously gay. It's going to Hell, where it shall be penetrated by that rainbow-thing for all eternity.  >:(


*/hat*  ;D

Actually, according to the book Heaven is for Real (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_Is_for_Real), she exists in heaven with Jesus.  ;)

QuoteJust as I was processing the implications of my son's statement--that he had met John the Baptist--Coulton spied a plastic horse among his toys and held it up to me to look at. "Hey, Dad, did you know Jesus had a horse?"
"A horse?"
"Yeah, a rainbow horse. I got to pet him. There's lots of colors."

:D

(Oh, and apparently she changed sexes on the way up there.  :P)

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on January 28, 2012, 11:39:38 PM
There is no justification for the terrible things I said and the awful messages I spread while a christian. I know what I did was just terrible and if I could take it back I would, but I can't. I hate the ignorant, stupid person I once was and the mistakes I made as him.

I generally don't go in much for forgiveness (I go in for it some, just not much) and self-forgiveness often seems to me like issuing yourself a "get out of jail free" card but in cases like yours I think you're entitled.  You did what you did (you'll forgive the expression) in good faith and you honestly didn't know any better.  Once you did, you stopped and that could have been no easy thing -- upending everything you'd believed to that point.  So I say good on you and give yourself a break, at least on this one.

I don't think I have the right to forgive myself. I opposed the progression of our species and the happiness of others. I promoted hate and ignorance.
I want to help the groups I once blindly hated. I know it will never make up for what I did or said, but maybe then they can forgive me.   

I agree with BCE.  I think you should give yourself a break and just strive to "do better" now that you know better.

As Kilgore Trout would say "You were sick but now you're well, and there's work to do."

That is probably a better way to look at it.

Quote from: Ali on January 29, 2012, 02:07:25 AM
As Kilgore Trout would say "You were sick but now you're well, and there's work to do."

I love that -- where is it from?

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on January 29, 2012, 12:43:58 AM

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on January 28, 2012, 11:39:38 PM
There is no justification for the terrible things I said and the awful messages I spread while a christian. I know what I did was just terrible and if I could take it back I would, but I can't. I hate the ignorant, stupid person I once was and the mistakes I made as him.

I generally don't go in much for forgiveness (I go in for it some, just not much) and self-forgiveness often seems to me like issuing yourself a "get out of jail free" card but in cases like yours I think you're entitled.  You did what you did (you'll forgive the expression) in good faith and you honestly didn't know any better.  Once you did, you stopped and that could have been no easy thing -- upending everything you'd believed to that point.  So I say good on you and give yourself a break, at least on this one.

Very well put BCE.

Washburn, you were conned into you're beliefs and exploited by the churches you attended. The fact that you discovered this and did something about it is a great credit to you.

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on January 29, 2012, 01:35:34 AM
I don't think I have the right to forgive myself. I opposed the progression of our species and the happiness of others. I promoted hate and ignorance.
I want to help the groups I once blindly hated. I know it will never make up for what I did or said, but maybe then they can forgive me.   

With all due respect. Bullshit!  ;D

If you saw sombody who had been brainwashed behaving in a brainwashed fashion would you blame them for their actions? Of course not. So don't blame yourself! Institutionalised superstitions have had millenium to perfect their conditioning techniques it's not a surprise they work. Kids and youngsters are evolved to believe adults so if the adults feed kids the same memes they learned those memes are perpetuated until somebody breaks the chain of infection. You have broken that chain of infection. As did my father for himself and thus me, my children and grandchildren. Be proud of yourself, you've earned it!

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx
I don't think I have the right to forgive myself. , but maybe they can forgive me.   

Like love, if you cannot love yourself there is slim chance others will love you

We carry suitcases of bullshit from the past in our present mind.

if you found the earth on which we all stand, as you sound you have, drop the fucking suitcases and face the rising human sun

if you have killed people, a particular ritual is needed for your sanity, but I am not professional in that field

otherwise anything else you may have done and said is worth forgeting as we daily forget about our waste and rubbish

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on January 29, 2012, 02:33:22 AM

Quote from: Ali on January 29, 2012, 02:07:25 AM
As Kilgore Trout would say "You were sick but now you're well, and there's work to do."

I love that -- where is it from?

Timequake.  Wonderful Kurt Vonnegut book. 

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on January 29, 2012, 01:35:34 AM
I don't think I have the right to forgive myself. I opposed the progression of our species and the happiness of others. I promoted hate and ignorance.
I want to help the groups I once blindly hated. I know it will never make up for what I did or said, but maybe then they can forgive me.   

I also applaud you for choosing to stand on your principles and choose to think for yourself rather than what other people have told you to think. I am sorry that you are also struggling with some emotional baggage over this; I hope this forum helps in some way.
If you don't mind me asking, is this forum still the only place where you have expressed your newfound atheism, or have you still not told anyone in real life? It would be good to have another outlet to talk, but I don't know if that's possible in your situation.

Quote from: Firebird on January 29, 2012, 09:03:03 PM

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on January 29, 2012, 01:35:34 AM
I don't think I have the right to forgive myself. I opposed the progression of our species and the happiness of others. I promoted hate and ignorance.
I want to help the groups I once blindly hated. I know it will never make up for what I did or said, but maybe then they can forgive me.   

I also applaud you for choosing to stand on your principles and choose to think for yourself rather than what other people have told you to think. I am sorry that you are also struggling with some emotional baggage over this; I hope this forum helps in some way.
If you don't mind me asking, is this forum still the only place where you have expressed your newfound atheism, or have you still not told anyone in real life? It would be good to have another outlet to talk, but I don't know if that's possible in your situation.

I still haven't told anyone irl.
With that said, I really appreciate the help and support.

I never had to deconvert since I never had any faith in any so called "living god". Up until my tweens, I accepted the god of the gaps out of explanatory convenience (was young and didn't know better) but that was about it. I'm another who gradually just realised that I was an atheist.

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on January 30, 2012, 12:36:46 AM

Quote from: Firebird on January 29, 2012, 09:03:03 PM

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on January 29, 2012, 01:35:34 AM
I don't think I have the right to forgive myself. I opposed the progression of our species and the happiness of others. I promoted hate and ignorance.
I want to help the groups I once blindly hated. I know it will never make up for what I did or said, but maybe then they can forgive me.   

I also applaud you for choosing to stand on your principles and choose to think for yourself rather than what other people have told you to think. I am sorry that you are also struggling with some emotional baggage over this; I hope this forum helps in some way.
If you don't mind me asking, is this forum still the only place where you have expressed your newfound atheism, or have you still not told anyone in real life? It would be good to have another outlet to talk, but I don't know if that's possible in your situation.

I still haven't told anyone irl.
With that said, I really appreciate the help and support.

It will get easier.  I still remember the day it hit me that "Oh wow, I'm an adult and I can live my life any way I choose; no one's approval is necessary."

[quote ]
I want to hear how some of you came to atheism.
[/quote]

I saw Nietzsche kill god and joined the party with the rest of us mortals

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXxI don't think I have the right to forgive myself. I opposed the progression of our species and the happiness of others. I promoted hate and ignorance.
I want to help the groups I once blindly hated. I know it will never make up for what I did or said, but maybe then they can forgive me.   

No one is proud of the views they held in the past. That's why they no longer hold them. I'm embarrassed about opinions I had yesterday, even more so for the day before. I sometimes read my old posts on here and think, "What the hell was I talking about? How could I have been so blind?"

In consolation though, you have no responsibility to be right all the time. That you were wrong does not make you a bad person or an idiot. That you can admit you were wrong, in my opinion, makes you both good and wise.

Quote from: Melmoth on February 02, 2012, 06:21:10 PM
No one is proud of the views they held in the past. That's why they no longer hold them. I'm embarrassed about opinions I had yesterday, even more so for the day before. I sometimes read my old posts on here and think, "What the hell was I talking about? How could I have been so blind?"

In consolation though, you have no responsibility to be right all the time. That you were wrong does not make you a bad person or an idiot. That you can admit you were wrong, in my opinion, makes you both good and wise.

Good comment. Something The Asmo could have said on a nicer day.

I'm back. I went and thought about who I was, what I did and who I am now, how I've changed, what you guys said and I'm feeling less "to blame" now. I told one of my friends about my newfound atheism and while he wasn't too angry, he wasn't happy either. We had a short conversation about how I was going to hell until I told him I didn't believe in hell and he saw that his threats of eternal hellfire and damnation didn't affect me so he let it go. He still goes to church but only because his parents force him to. I haven't been contacted by any members of the church so I don't think he sees it as a major "problem" that should be seen shared with the church.

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on February 23, 2012, 11:06:08 PM
I'm back. I went and thought about who I was, what I did and who I am now, how I've changed, what you guys said and I'm feeling less "to blame" now. I told one of my friends about my newfound atheism and while he wasn't too angry, he wasn't happy either. We had a short conversation about how I was going to hell until I told him I didn't believe in hell and he saw that his threats of eternal hellfire and damnation didn't affect me so he let it go. He still goes to church but only because his parents force him to. I haven't been contacted by any members of the church so I don't think he sees it as a major "problem" that should be seen shared with the church.

Washburn, good to see you, and glad you're back. I'm glad you decided to have that conversation with your friend. When you think about it, though, if your friend expects you to accept him just as he is beliefs in God and all, then you have the right to expect him to accept you just as you are, whether you believe or not. A friend who tries to coerce you over to their side or tries to get a larger group (ie, a church) to sway your mind and drag you back wouldn't be acting like a friend... so, it's a good thing that so far, he's wisely kept quiet and let you just sort your ideas out for yourself, as you should be able to.

You're going to run into a lot of "friends" over the years whose friendship will only be conditional on whether or not you agree with them. Those folks won't be friends, and those relationships will fall apart. After I realized I was no longer Christian, then no longer a theist at all, I did lose some people who I thought were friends -- it turns out though, that they were more interested in needing me to affirm their beliefs than they were interested in just knowing me, person to person. Such is life, I guess. I'm glad that right now, the group of people I have in my life who I trust and love is a smaller group, but every person in it relates to me as a person, and not as a target of possible conversion/in need of being saved.

My wish and hope for you is that as time goes on and you do speak to more people about your ideas and your nonbelief, you find similar folks. They don't all have to be atheists or skeptics, but they do all have to be willing to respect you just as you are. There's nothing wrong with you. There's nothing about you that needs to be saved. You're just you. :) Congrats on being able to see that, and on being able to change your views and to reject what you used to believe that you've come to realize isn't right for you. That takes guts. :)

I didn't expect him to have much of a problem since he's been my best friend almost since birth. He himself is a moderate christian, and like I said only goes to church because his parents force him.

Quote from: xXxWashburnxXx on February 24, 2012, 12:03:55 AM
I didn't expect him to have much of a problem since he's been my best friend almost since birth. He himself is a moderate christian, and like I said only goes to church because his parents force him.

OK, cool. Yeah, there are more than a couple moderate, easygoing liberal Christians I get along well with -- I respect that they hold beliefs, and I'm happy that they have no problem with my position either. Most people who only go to church because family makes them go won't stay going once they're adults, anyhow. They might hang onto some of the beliefs, but if church isn't their thing, then it isn't their thing.

Quote from: orangemoon on January 27, 2012, 10:29:33 AM
I'm not actually converted yet... lol.

I made an introduction post some months ago and got sidetracked by life, but I'm back and I just want to be apart of a community that is sane. I think that I'm in the agnostic realm but I keep asking myself why I'm scared to just go for it and completely be atheist......

You're already there, orangemoon. As an agnostic, your answer to the question "do you believe in a god?" is not "yes". That makes you an atheist. Welcome.  :)

I was actually raised in a cult. (When I say "cult", I mean a small group of people adhering to a set of beliefs that are not mainstream to the culture.) My dad and bro left the cult when I was about 7 years old. But, my mom and I stayed. Needless to say, my parents divorced. My dad started going to church and taking me on the weekends that he had me. I started seeing the huge differences in what the church believed and what my mom and I believed. I started seeing how crazy the cult was (as if Christianity wasn't any crazier, but it seemed normal at the time). So, I de-converted from the cult and went to live with my dad when I was 12. I was very disillusioned by the cult. We thought we were special and had the truth. But, we were just delusional. But, being as young as I was, I just assumed that Christianity was true because most people believed it.

Well, after getting my Biochemistry degree in my twenties, I started relying way more in my intellect than ever before. I just started doubting my faith. I was scared......soooo scared to think about it. I would wake up at night in a panic, afraid of going to Hell. It was extremely difficult finally facing my doubts. One of the first things I had to do was entertain the idea that Hell wasn't real. Then, that really opened the flood gates. Once I accepted Hell might not be real, I was able to really think freely. I went on a five year roller coaster ride oscillating from belief, to disbelief, and back and forth. I had reasons for both sides.

Then, one day, I just stopped believing. I think the big moment for me was realizing that the things written in the Bible don't happen in real life. People aren't born of virgins, turn water to wine, walk on water, rise from the dead, and fly up into the air to meet god. In addition, I asked god to levitate the chair in my living room....and, He didn't... ;D He's not there. I also, just for good measure, asked God to have someone tell me what I'm thinking. I thought up something random - the Pythagorean Theorem. I thought that if just one person at church could have a prophecy for me that they would say "God told me to tell you that you having been thinking of the Pythagorean Theorem." I would totally believe...well, he may have to  levitate the chair too  :-\ But, anyways, god consistently fails me. Therefore, he isn't there.

Asherah, thank you for sharing that -- it really sounds like you've had quite the journey out of theism, first the cult, and then Christianity itself. If you've ever got some spare time, I'd suggest you download Rich & Deanna Joy Lyons' podcast, 'Living After Faith'. Rich was a pastor in a cult-like church for several years, and after he came out of it he suffered PTSD big time. It took a long, long while for him to get his life sorted out, but his journey out was incredible and well worth it.

I understand the feeling of trying to see if God's there by asking for silly little things that would 'prove' his existence to you, like having someone tell you what you're thinking. Just something small, and personal, that would give you reason to suspect God might actually be listening.

I know after coming out of Christianity, I was haunted by it for a while. By that, I mean that thinking like a Christian, thinking like a theist even, was so ingrained in my head that thoughts would rise unbidden for a long time. I'd read something, and the theist argument for or against it would pop up in my mind, even though I no longer believed it to be true -- it's just that you can take someone out of the church, but you can't as easily take the church out of someone, I guess. Even if you really, REALLY want to. And I wanted to. I wanted the theistic thinking out of my head, because it was driving me nuts for a good long while. Literally.

It reminds me of an old poem that's always described the feeling very well.

William Hughes Mearns is the poet.

    Yesterday upon the stair
    I met a man who wasn't there
    He wasn't there again today
    Oh, how I wish he'd go away

    When I came home last night at three
    The man was waiting there for me
    But when I looked around the hall
    I couldn't see him there at all!
    Go away, go away, don't you come back any more!
    Go away, go away, and please don't slam the door

    Last night I saw upon the stair
    A little man who wasn't there
    He wasn't there again today
    Oh, how I wish he'd go away

        "Antigonish" (1899)

Hi Amicale,

Thanks for the empathetic response. I will look into reading the book you recommended. It would be helpful to hear someone elses experience. I've never thought about PTSD happening after leaving a cult, but it makes sense.

It is so hard to get it out of my head, too. And, I want it gone!! Everyone around me is Christian, so I hear the mindset quite frequently, But, I'm starting to notice that I'm having a theistic mind set less and less. And, the less I have one, the easier it is to see the faulty thinking in religious people. It's extremely difficult to notice any of it when you are "in it".

Nice poem. Thanks  :)

Quote from: Asherah on March 16, 2012, 03:48:25 AM
I was actually raised in a cult. (When I say "cult", I mean a small group of people adhering to a set of beliefs that are not mainstream to the culture.) My dad and bro left the cult when I was about 7 years old. But, my mom and I stayed. Needless to say, my parents divorced. My dad started going to church and taking me on the weekends that he had me. I started seeing the huge differences in what the church believed and what my mom and I believed. I started seeing how crazy the cult was (as if Christianity wasn't any crazier, but it seemed normal at the time). So, I de-converted from the cult and went to live with my dad when I was 12. I was very disillusioned by the cult. We thought we were special and had the truth. But, we were just delusional. But, being as young as I was, I just assumed that Christianity was true because most people believed it.

Well, after getting my Biochemistry degree in my twenties, I started relying way more in my intellect than ever before. I just started doubting my faith. I was scared......soooo scared to think about it. I would wake up at night in a panic, afraid of going to Hell. It was extremely difficult finally facing my doubts. One of the first things I had to do was entertain the idea that Hell wasn't real. Then, that really opened the flood gates. Once I accepted Hell might not be real, I was able to really think freely. I went on a five year roller coaster ride oscillating from belief, to disbelief, and back and forth. I had reasons for both sides.

Then, one day, I just stopped believing. I think the big moment for me was realizing that the things written in the Bible don't happen in real life. People aren't born of virgins, turn water to wine, walk on water, rise from the dead, and fly up into the air to meet god. In addition, I asked god to levitate the chair in my living room....and, He didn't... ;D He's not there. I also, just for good measure, asked God to have someone tell me what I'm thinking. I thought up something random - the Pythagorean Theorem. I thought that if just one person at church could have a prophecy for me that they would say "God told me to tell you that you having been thinking of the Pythagorean Theorem." I would totally believe...well, he may have to  levitate the chair too  :-\ But, anyways, god consistently fails me. Therefore, he isn't there.

Wow, you've had quite the journey. I'm impressed.

Quote from: Asherah on March 16, 2012, 03:48:25 AM
Then, one day, I just stopped believing. I think the big moment for me was realizing that the things written in the Bible don't happen in real life. People aren't born of virgins, turn water to wine, walk on water, rise from the dead, and fly up into the air to meet god. In addition, I asked god to levitate the chair in my living room....and, He didn't... ;D He's not there. I also, just for good measure, asked God to have someone tell me what I'm thinking. I thought up something random - the Pythagorean Theorem. I thought that if just one person at church could have a prophecy for me that they would say "God told me to tell you that you having been thinking of the Pythagorean Theorem." I would totally believe...well, he may have to  levitate the chair too 

When I was "losing the faith" my test was praying that God would give me complete faith again. I mean, really, it makes no sense why he wouldn't. God wanted us to have faith. I wanted to have faith. I wasn't asking for anything selfish, I just wanted to believe what he wanted me to believe. But nope. It didn't work.

So, if it turns out that I'm wrong and there is a God, I can say it was his fault! If he wanted me to be a believer, he should have answered my last prayer!

It's really sad how many "chances" some us give to an imaginary person. 

Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on March 22, 2012, 02:00:24 AM

Quote from: Asherah on March 16, 2012, 03:48:25 AM
Then, one day, I just stopped believing. I think the big moment for me was realizing that the things written in the Bible don't happen in real life. People aren't born of virgins, turn water to wine, walk on water, rise from the dead, and fly up into the air to meet god. In addition, I asked god to levitate the chair in my living room....and, He didn't... ;D He's not there. I also, just for good measure, asked God to have someone tell me what I'm thinking. I thought up something random - the Pythagorean Theorem. I thought that if just one person at church could have a prophecy for me that they would say "God told me to tell you that you having been thinking of the Pythagorean Theorem." I would totally believe...well, he may have to  levitate the chair too

When I was "losing the faith" my test was praying that God would give me complete faith again. I mean, really, it makes no sense why he wouldn't. God wanted us to have faith. I wanted to have faith. I wasn't asking for anything selfish, I just wanted to believe what he wanted me to believe. But nope. It didn't work.

So, if it turns out that I'm wrong and there is a God, I can say it was his fault! If he wanted me to be a believer, he should have answered my last prayer!

It's really sad how many "chances" some us give to an imaginary person.  

DJ, it went very much the same way for me. I started experiencing what Christians sometimes refer to as "really dry faith". I wasn't feeling it, I was questioning it like crazy, and the whole time I was praying that God would just give me my faith back -- and obviously, it didn't happen. It's not like I needed some happy sappy lovey dovey feeling. A firm conviction in my beliefs solely on intellectual grounds would have done me just fine, even if I never felt "close" to God again, as I used to think I did. But alas, no. It was like the more questions I asked, the more doors just kept slamming shut until I realized I was on the other side of faith, and I couldn't go back in again.

If it turns out I'm wrong and there is a God, and that God is the one described in the Bible, I'd have a heck of a lot of questions for him, everything from so many people begging for faith only to be denied, to the sorry, sad state of affairs here on earth for so many of his "children". Am I angry at God? Well, no, I'd only be angry if I thought he actually existed as described. The only excuse this 'god' has is that he/she/it in all likelihood doesn't exist. I know too many people who lost their faith the way I did, DJ did, others here and elsewhere did.

DJ, you said it's really sad how many chances some of us give to an imaginary person. Well, I gave 'him' lots of chances. And you know the saddest thing? I never saw it that way. Instead, I was the one asking that 'god' for "just one more chance" because I was convinced that I had been the one who screwed up and wasn't faithful enough for HIM. Go figure. Faith fucks with your head, it really, truly does. If I do one good thing in this world, it'll be to spare my daughter the childhood indoctrination I got, myself... and just teach her how to ask questions from the get go, and let her know how precious and loved she is just for being HER, not because she needs some kind of "salvation".

Quote from: DeterminedJuliet on March 22, 2012, 02:00:24 AM

Quote from: Asherah on March 16, 2012, 03:48:25 AM
Then, one day, I just stopped believing. I think the big moment for me was realizing that the things written in the Bible don't happen in real life. People aren't born of virgins, turn water to wine, walk on water, rise from the dead, and fly up into the air to meet god. In addition, I asked god to levitate the chair in my living room....and, He didn't... ;D He's not there. I also, just for good measure, asked God to have someone tell me what I'm thinking. I thought up something random - the Pythagorean Theorem. I thought that if just one person at church could have a prophecy for me that they would say "God told me to tell you that you having been thinking of the Pythagorean Theorem." I would totally believe...well, he may have to  levitate the chair too 

When I was "losing the faith" my test was praying that God would give me complete faith again. I mean, really, it makes no sense why he wouldn't. God wanted us to have faith. I wanted to have faith. I wasn't asking for anything selfish, I just wanted to believe what he wanted me to believe. But nope. It didn't work.

So, if it turns out that I'm wrong and there is a God, I can say it was his fault! If he wanted me to be a believer, he should have answered my last prayer!

It's really sad how many "chances" some us give to an imaginary person. 

I've prayed that too!! And, my family is praying for that! And, I still don't believe. It's so crazy to realize that for 15 years I've been praying and serving a god who isn't there!!! It's surreal. I'm glad I can move on, though. I'm so tired of trying to "hear his voice" and be "lead by the spirit".....whatever the hell all that means.

I asked too many questions!!!   :D No one had a satisfying answer  :'( , well at least my parents, relatives, and church didn't. I remember being in like first or second grade and asking my Catholic teacher(for first communion preparation)what God was made out of and she looked really nervous...lol...and told me he was made of a spirit, like a soul. So I asked the next obvious question, what does a soul looked like? She was hesitant, but drew an outline of a human figure on the chalkboard with what he looked like something between the symbol for a number (#) and a knotted ball of yard over the chest and then smiled. YIKES!!!  :o I was TOTALLY not impressed.

Then there were those numerous nights, about third or fourth grade, when I would lie awake at night and think about outer space and God.  ::) Back then, we were taught in science class that the universe went on forever and that was extremely hard to grasp as a child. Forever? Really?!! Everything has a boundary, my house, my body, the block I lived on, the country I lived in, how could the universe not have one. If it did then there must be something on the other side of that boundary, right? Where does that END?!! AHHH!!! BRAIN FREEZE!!!! The same thing with God. Who made him and WHO made HIS creator?!! AAHH!!! ANOTHER BRAIN FREEZE!!! Then God said, "Kid, shut the hell up and go to bed." So I did ;)

Education is really what tipped me in the right direction, along with my natural curiosity, toward atheism. Learning about the natural forces that actually make the world go round made me realize that if there is a God, then it at most, far removed from personal matters. Although I occasionally have "spiritual moments", or fits, as I like to call them, they are usually brief and go away as readily as the antidotal, logistical medicine is applied. :D

Quote from: Jimmy on March 24, 2012, 06:55:44 PM
I asked too many questions!!!   :D No one had a satisfying answer  :'( , well at least my parents, relatives, and church didn't.

Yep.  Nothing made sense, and the more I studied the less sense it made.  I was told I would understand . . . eventually . . . when I was older.  And I guess I did, tho not in the way I was intended to.  I read the bible front to back and understood that as a collection of moral fables went it was no worse than most, but not really any better either.  As a practical guide to life it had several good points that could also be found in other religions or secular philosophies, and a whole lot of bullshit.  Which I'm not condemning either the bible or its compliers for, that's generally how it goes with old stories.  But I'm supposed to be accepting this as literally true (which was way I was taught) and for modern day use?  No.

Quote. . .  if there is a God, then it at most, far removed from personal matters.

That's pretty much where I'm at.  There may well be a god, for all I know or can know, but I seriously doubt the various guesses of humans have any resemblence the possible actuality, and the Xtian god seems to me particularly improbable with its aggressively human slant.

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on March 24, 2012, 07:39:16 PM

Quote from: Jimmy on March 24, 2012, 06:55:44 PM
I asked too many questions!!!   :D No one had a satisfying answer  :'( , well at least my parents, relatives, and church didn't.

Yep.  Nothing made sense, and the more I studied the less sense it made.  I was told I would understand . . . eventually . . . when I was older.  And I guess I did, tho not in the way I was intended to.  I read the bible front to back and understood that as a collection of moral fables went it was no worse than most, but not really any better either.  As a practical guide to life it had several good points that could also be found in other religions or secular philosophies, and a whole lot of bullshit.  Which I'm not condemning either the bible or its compliers for, that's generally how it goes with old stories.  But I'm supposed to be accepting this as literally true (which was way I was taught) and for modern day use?  No.

Quote. . .  if there is a God, then it at most, far removed from personal matters.

That's pretty much where I'm at.  There may well be a god, for all I know or can know, but I seriously doubt the various guesses of humans have any resemblence the possible actualifty, and the Xtian god seems to me particularly improbable with its aggressively human slant.

Exactly!! Even if there IS one, I'm sure it's not biased in favor of humans or that any of the religions are "right" about the characteristics that being may have; or how it behave toward us.

Quote from: Jimmy on March 25, 2012, 07:32:06 PM

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on March 24, 2012, 07:39:16 PM

Quote from: Jimmy on March 24, 2012, 06:55:44 PM
I asked too many questions!!!   :D No one had a satisfying answer  :'( , well at least my parents, relatives, and church didn't.

Yep.  Nothing made sense, and the more I studied the less sense it made.  I was told I would understand . . . eventually . . . when I was older.  And I guess I did, tho not in the way I was intended to.  I read the bible front to back and understood that as a collection of moral fables went it was no worse than most, but not really any better either.  As a practical guide to life it had several good points that could also be found in other religions or secular philosophies, and a whole lot of bullshit.  Which I'm not condemning either the bible or its compliers for, that's generally how it goes with old stories.  But I'm supposed to be accepting this as literally true (which was way I was taught) and for modern day use?  No.

Quote. . .  if there is a God, then it at most, far removed from personal matters.

That's pretty much where I'm at.  There may well be a god, for all I know or can know, but I seriously doubt the various guesses of humans have any resemblence the possible actualifty, and the Xtian god seems to me particularly improbable with its aggressively human slant.

Exactly!! Even if there IS one, I'm sure it's not biased in favor of humans or that any of the religions are "right" about the characteristics that being may have; or how it behave toward us.

Right on. After all, humans being the most "sentient" or "intelligent" being on earth wouldn't mean that humans would by default be the favourite being of a creator. Perhaps that creator would enjoy the dolphins or snails best. Or perhaps earth was just a practice demo or trial run for some other planet out there in another galaxy far, far away, and the creator's lavishing all of its attention on the creatures that inhabit it. Perhaps a creator would give no more individual attention to its creation than any artist on earth gives to their creation -- they paint/build/make it, and then everything's done, and that's that!  ;) How are we to know, and who are we to say?  :D

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 08:02:21 PM
Right on. After all, humans being the most "sentient" or "intelligent" being on earth wouldn't mean that humans would by default be the favourite being of a creator. Perhaps that creator would enjoy the dolphins or snails best.

If we judge popularity with the divine by how many of a thing it made, then insects are far and away it's favorites and we are in serious trouble for inventing Raid.

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on March 25, 2012, 08:06:31 PM

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 08:02:21 PM
Right on. After all, humans being the most "sentient" or "intelligent" being on earth wouldn't mean that humans would by default be the favourite being of a creator. Perhaps that creator would enjoy the dolphins or snails best.

If we judge popularity with the divine by how many of a thing it made, then insects are far and away it's favorites and we are in serious trouble for inventing Raid.

*nods solemnly*

And for using flyswatters, bug zappers, and doing away with 8-legged freaks.  :D

In fact, my worst nightmare is that I die one day, wake up again, realize 'oh, there WAS a God' and that God turns out to be a many-legged insect or spider. I think that would be hell, for me!

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 08:09:20 PM

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on March 25, 2012, 08:06:31 PM

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 08:02:21 PM
Right on. After all, humans being the most "sentient" or "intelligent" being on earth wouldn't mean that humans would by default be the favourite being of a creator. Perhaps that creator would enjoy the dolphins or snails best.

If we judge popularity with the divine by how many of a thing it made, then insects are far and away it's favorites and we are in serious trouble for inventing Raid.

*nods solemnly*

And for using flyswatters, bug zappers, and doing away with 8-legged freaks.  :D

In fact, my worst nightmare is that I die one day, wake up again, realize 'oh, there WAS a God' and that God turns out to be a many-legged insect or spider. I think that would be hell, for me!

LOL, how ironic that would be!!

You know, the way humans are killing off everything else, I'm sure we would be God's least favorite. "Damn humans destroy everything I've created! What to do? I KNOW!! I'll just turn up the thermostat just a weee little bit....There, that'll show the little suckers..BAH HAH HAA!! I haven't had THAT much fun since Babylon !!"

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 08:09:20 PM
8-legged freaks.  :D

Not insets, those. Different kind of arthropods.

Quote from: Asmodean on March 25, 2012, 08:27:01 PM

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 08:09:20 PM
8-legged freaks.  :D

Not insets, those. Different kind of arthropods.

Yes. Arachnids. Which sounds creepy just to type, and makes me itch all over.  :D

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 08:28:30 PM
Yes. Arachnids. Which sounds creepy just to type, and makes me itch all over.  :D

Yup. Pieders. Big, nasty, creepy pieders with HUGE fangs.

Quote from: Asmodean on March 25, 2012, 09:29:06 PM

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 08:28:30 PM
Yes. Arachnids. Which sounds creepy just to type, and makes me itch all over.  :D

Yup. Pieders. Big, nasty, creepy pieders with HUGE fangs.

Little Miss Muffet
Sat on her tuffet
Eating her curds and whey
Along came a spider
And sat down beside her
And said "Excuse me, is this seat taken?"
;D

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 09:46:29 PM
Eating her curds and whey

I seriously read "eating her turds and whey" there.  :o

Quote from: xSilverPhinx on March 25, 2012, 10:37:41 PM

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 09:46:29 PM
Eating her curds and whey

I seriously read "eating her turds and whey" there.  :o

Paging Dr Fraud! Is Dr Fraud available?

Quote from: xSilverPhinx on March 25, 2012, 10:37:41 PM

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 09:46:29 PM
Eating her curds and whey

I seriously read "eating her turds and whey" there.  :o

Probably because the "t" in tuffet is directly above the "c" in curds. I do that often!

Quote from: Tank on March 26, 2012, 08:36:03 AM

Quote from: xSilverPhinx on March 25, 2012, 10:37:41 PM

Quote from: Amicale on March 25, 2012, 09:46:29 PM
Eating her curds and whey

I seriously read "eating her turds and whey" there.  :o

Paging Dr Fraud! Is Dr Fraud available?

Tank...are you suggesting that it was a Freudian slip on my part?  :o

:-X

I am still Roman Catholic.

Quote from: The Semaestro on March 26, 2012, 09:50:38 PM
I am still Roman Catholic.

Cool. :) I used to be, also.

My cat was also Roamin' Cat-lick. Then she briefly tried the catnip over at the Puss-byterians, and now she's an athei-hissssst.  ;D

Quote from: Amicale on March 27, 2012, 12:14:34 AM

Quote from: The Semaestro on March 26, 2012, 09:50:38 PM
I am still Roman Catholic.

Cool. :) I used to be, also.

My cat was also Roamin' Cat-lick. Then she briefly tried the catnip over at the Puss-byterians, and now she's an athei-hissssst.  ;D

Ha!

Sounds like one fine pussy.  :o

Quote from: Amicale on March 27, 2012, 12:14:34 AM

Quote from: The Semaestro on March 26, 2012, 09:50:38 PM
I am still Roman Catholic.

Cool. :) I used to be, also.

My cat was also Roamin' Cat-lick. Then she briefly tried the catnip over at the Puss-byterians, and now she's an athei-hissssst.  ;D

*high five*

Quote from: Ali on March 27, 2012, 05:38:05 PM

Quote from: Amicale on March 27, 2012, 12:14:34 AM

Quote from: The Semaestro on March 26, 2012, 09:50:38 PM
I am still Roman Catholic.

Cool. :) I used to be, also.

My cat was also Roamin' Cat-lick. Then she briefly tried the catnip over at the Puss-byterians, and now she's an athei-hissssst.  ;D

*high five*

Best puns ever. My pal Taguchi would love you. :)

Quote from: Amicale on March 27, 2012, 12:14:34 AM

Quote from: The Semaestro on March 26, 2012, 09:50:38 PM
I am still Roman Catholic.

Cool. :) I used to be, also.

My cat was also Roamin' Cat-lick. Then she briefly tried the catnip over at the Puss-byterians, and now she's an athei-hissssst.  ;D

You damn near killed me, woman! Choked on my morning coffee.  ;D

Ali, SD and Guardian, glad to have been  (needing to call an ambulance for Guardian)  of service!  ;D

I've been an atheist all my life, but the topic of conversion to atheism has interested me for a while.
It didn't even occur to me until a few years ago that people unconvert from religion. It's not as though it seemed impossible, it just wasn't a line of thinking that I was really exposed to. You hear about people converting to new religions, but when people talk about atheism it's often just a standoff between two people on TV. They talk about ideas but not themselves so much. Atheist just kind of...are.
Then I told a group of fellow students that I was atheist, and one guy asked me "Oh, when did you lose your faith?"
I was surprised. Why would I need have it in the first place? And...that happens? I guess it must. How often does it happen?
That's a question I've had for a while (someone tell me if it's already been discussed here) What perscentage of Atheists have always been non-believers, and what percentage unconverted during thier lives?

Quote from: cgmccall on April 10, 2012, 08:33:30 PM
I've been an atheist all my life, but the topic of conversion to atheism has interested me for a while.
It didn't even occur to me until a few years ago that people unconvert from religion. It's not as though it seemed impossible, it just wasn't a line of thinking that I was really exposed to. You hear about people converting to new religions, but when people talk about atheism it's often just a standoff between two people on TV. They talk about ideas but not themselves so much. Atheist just kind of...are.
Then I told a group of fellow students that I was atheist, and one guy asked me "Oh, when did you lose your faith?"
I was surprised. Why would I need have it in the first place? And...that happens? I guess it must. How often does it happen?
That's a question I've had for a while (someone tell me if it's already been discussed here) What perscentage of Atheists have always been non-believers, and what percentage unconverted during thier lives?

Very interesting.  I always answer I have never lost faith, only have no religious superstitions. I have been an atheist since childhood.   About 70 years.
Anne

Quote from: lebrecht52 on April 11, 2012, 03:19:27 AM

Quote from: cgmccall on April 10, 2012, 08:33:30 PM
I've been an atheist all my life, but the topic of conversion to atheism has interested me for a while.
It didn't even occur to me until a few years ago that people unconvert from religion. It's not as though it seemed impossible, it just wasn't a line of thinking that I was really exposed to. You hear about people converting to new religions, but when people talk about atheism it's often just a standoff between two people on TV. They talk about ideas but not themselves so much. Atheist just kind of...are.
Then I told a group of fellow students that I was atheist, and one guy asked me "Oh, when did you lose your faith?"
I was surprised. Why would I need have it in the first place? And...that happens? I guess it must. How often does it happen?
That's a question I've had for a while (someone tell me if it's already been discussed here) What perscentage of Atheists have always been non-believers, and what percentage unconverted during thier lives?

Very interesting.  I always answer I have never lost faith, only have no religious superstitions. I have been an atheist since childhood.   About 70 years.
Anne

:)

One way of saying it that we seem to have recently adopted on the forum as being a neat idea is this: if you never had any religious beliefs, you would be a never-theist, whereas if you had religious beliefs but gave them up, you'd be an ex-theist. I like the distinction, because when you tell someone you're an atheist, they still don't quite know how you got to that position. Myself, I'm an ex-theist atheist.

May I ask, just for the sake of curiosity... when you were a teenager or a young adult, did you ever feel any inclination to explore religious beliefs? Or was it never of any interest to you?

Quote from: lebrecht52 on April 11, 2012, 03:19:27 AM
Very interesting.  I always answer I have never lost faith, only have no religious superstitions. I have been an atheist since childhood.   About 70 years.
Anne

I say that I never lost faith because I had none to lose -- it just took me awhile to realize that and stop trying.

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on April 11, 2012, 03:33:52 AM

Quote from: lebrecht52 on April 11, 2012, 03:19:27 AM
Very interesting.  I always answer I have never lost faith, only have no religious superstitions. I have been an atheist since childhood.   About 70 years.
Anne

I say that I never lost faith because I had none to lose -- it just took me awhile to realize that and stop trying.

Ex-cultural Christian in your case, then? ;D

Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 11, 2012, 03:35:35 AM

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on April 11, 2012, 03:33:52 AM

Quote from: lebrecht52 on April 11, 2012, 03:19:27 AM
Very interesting.  I always answer I have never lost faith, only have no religious superstitions. I have been an atheist since childhood.   About 70 years.
Anne

I say that I never lost faith because I had none to lose -- it just took me awhile to realize that and stop trying.

Ex-cultural Christian in your case, then? ;D

I'm not even sure how ex- the cultural part is, given my enthusiasm for holidays.  I'm probably lucky I woke up enough to dump the Xtian part.

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on April 11, 2012, 03:44:15 AM

Quote from: xSilverPhinx on April 11, 2012, 03:35:35 AM

Quote from: BooksCatsEtc on April 11, 2012, 03:33:52 AM

Quote from: lebrecht52 on April 11, 2012, 03:19:27 AM
Very interesting.  I always answer I have never lost faith, only have no religious superstitions. I have been an atheist since childhood.   About 70 years.
Anne

I say that I never lost faith because I had none to lose -- it just took me awhile to realize that and stop trying.

Ex-cultural Christian in your case, then? ;D

I'm not even sure how ex- the cultural part is, given my enthusiasm for holidays.  I'm probably lucky I woke up enough to dump the Xtian part.

I have a similar fondness for holidays. I don't let it bug me. I figure humans invented religion and religious traditions, including holidays... and while a lot of those holidays have a pretty generic 'secular' aspect to them, even if some of the religion seeps in, I don't worry about it. I don't believe all of it's bad. On the contrary, I think most of it's pretty fun, and I tend to enjoy myself by adopting whichever traditions I like, and scrapping any I don't want to bother with. I'm not ashamed to admit I enjoy listening to Christmas music, for example -- even if some of it has religious lyrics, well, so what? The songs are pretty! :)

*This is in response to the last few post about how can anyone lose faith if they don't have it to begin with*

Unfortunately, there ISN'T a word for making or convincing another human being to believe in a deity. I was born as an unbeliever of any dogma or superstition. I wasn't born an atheist, or an agnostic, or a theist, or Christian, but I definitely was born undeitized. . Now, I don't even know if deitized is even a word, I couldn't find much on it, but it suits my purposes for this post. For here, I mean it to be the process of training or indoctrinating someone to the existence of a deity or deities, and NOT the process of becoming a deity  :P .  In essence, I wasn't a Catholic until my parents, church, and friends persuaded me to foremost, be a theist, and secondly be a Catholic. To think of it now, it is astounding just how much indoctrination actually goes into this process of being deitized.

Now I think I've stated in an earlier post that I don't really like the word atheism because for one, it often used pejoratively, as in "losing one's faith," and secondly, it doesn't really explain my "beliefs" or lack thereof beliefs in a manner that gives ample weight or contrast to those of believers. Now if deitized is used to mean acquiring faith in the existence of a god, or gods, be it monotheistic, polytheistic, or deistic, then undeitized would mean the unacquiring of these beliefs and a return to the position I had when I was born, which was none. I would much prefer the contrast to be deitized versus undeitized because it obviates the amelioration of the word "faith" and forces us to see it for what it really is: Indoctrination.

My name is Jimmy, and I have been undeitized :P

Quote from: Jimmy on April 11, 2012, 05:03:12 AM
*This is in response to the last few post about how can anyone lose faith if they don't have it to begin with*

Unfortunately, there ISN'T a word for making or convincing another human being to believe in a deity. I was born as an unbeliever of any dogma or superstition. I wasn't born an atheist, or an agnostic, or a theist, or Christian, but I definitely was born undeitized. . Now, I don't even know if deitized is even a word, I couldn't find much on it, but it suits my purposes for this post. For here, I mean it to be the process of training or indoctrinating someone to the existence of a deity or deities, and NOT the process of becoming a deity  :P .  In essence, I wasn't a Catholic until my parents, church, and friends persuaded me to foremost, be a theist, and secondly be a Catholic. To think of it now, it is astounding just how much indoctrination actually goes into this process of being deitized.

Now I think I've stated in an earlier post that I don't really like the word atheism because for one, it often used pejoratively, as in "losing one's faith," and secondly, it doesn't really explain my "beliefs" or lack thereof beliefs in a manner that gives ample weight or contrast to those of believers. Now if deitized is used to mean acquiring faith in the existence of a god, or gods, be it monotheistic, polytheistic, or deistic, then undeitized would mean the unacquiring of these beliefs and a return to the position I had when I was born, which was none. I would much prefer the contrast to be deitized versus undeitized because it obviates the amelioration of the word "faith" and forces us to see it for what it really is: Indoctrination.

My name is Jimmy, and I have been undeitized :P

Well, I have to agree with you. When I tell people I am atheist, I almost feel like some take it as "used to be religious, but not anymore."

I know that is the case for some atheists, but most were just born HUMAN. Without religion or faith or any superstition, until it was cast upon them by parents and/or guardians.
I want to be human. I hate having to attached labels for society. I feel the same way about religion as I do about my sexuality. I am just ME. My non belief and sexual prefrence don't define me .
They don't validate or make choices for me.
My experience as an adult human being do.

Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 11, 2012, 06:50:06 AM

Quote from: Jimmy on April 11, 2012, 05:03:12 AM
*This is in response to the last few post about how can anyone lose faith if they don't have it to begin with*

Unfortunately, there ISN'T a word for making or convincing another human being to believe in a deity. I was born as an unbeliever of any dogma or superstition. I wasn't born an atheist, or an agnostic, or a theist, or Christian, but I definitely was born undeitized. . Now, I don't even know if deitized is even a word, I couldn't find much on it, but it suits my purposes for this post. For here, I mean it to be the process of training or indoctrinating someone to the existence of a deity or deities, and NOT the process of becoming a deity  :P .  In essence, I wasn't a Catholic until my parents, church, and friends persuaded me to foremost, be a theist, and secondly be a Catholic. To think of it now, it is astounding just how much indoctrination actually goes into this process of being deitized.

Now I think I've stated in an earlier post that I don't really like the word atheism because for one, it often used pejoratively, as in "losing one's faith," and secondly, it doesn't really explain my "beliefs" or lack thereof beliefs in a manner that gives ample weight or contrast to those of believers. Now if deitized is used to mean acquiring faith in the existence of a god, or gods, be it monotheistic, polytheistic, or deistic, then undeitized would mean the unacquiring of these beliefs and a return to the position I had when I was born, which was none. I would much prefer the contrast to be deitized versus undeitized because it obviates the amelioration of the word "faith" and forces us to see it for what it really is: Indoctrination.

My name is Jimmy, and I have been undeitized :P

Well, I have to agree with you. When I tell people I am atheist, I almost feel like some take it as "used to be religious, but not anymore."

I know that is the case for some atheists, but most were just born HUMAN. Without religion or faith or any superstition, until it was cast upon them by parents and/or guardians.
I want to be human. I hate having to attached labels for society. I feel the same way about religion as I do about my sexuality. I am just ME. My non belief and sexual prefrence don't define me .
They don't validate or make choices for me.
My experience as an adult human being do.

Right on, SD! I just added this to the member quotes thread.  ;D

Quote from: Jimmy on April 11, 2012, 05:03:12 AM
*This is in response to the last few post about how can anyone lose faith if they don't have it to begin with*

Unfortunately, there ISN'T a word for making or convincing another human being to believe in a deity.

Theised? (or Theized (US))
Theistified?
Theistificationalized?
Theistificationalisatified? (dictionary of George Bush)

religiously converted?

Quote from: Amicale on April 11, 2012, 06:54:28 AM

Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 11, 2012, 06:50:06 AM

Quote from: Jimmy on April 11, 2012, 05:03:12 AM
*This is in response to the last few post about how can anyone lose faith if they don't have it to begin with*

Unfortunately, there ISN'T a word for making or convincing another human being to believe in a deity. I was born as an unbeliever of any dogma or superstition. I wasn't born an atheist, or an agnostic, or a theist, or Christian, but I definitely was born undeitized. . Now, I don't even know if deitized is even a word, I couldn't find much on it, but it suits my purposes for this post. For here, I mean it to be the process of training or indoctrinating someone to the existence of a deity or deities, and NOT the process of becoming a deity  :P .  In essence, I wasn't a Catholic until my parents, church, and friends persuaded me to foremost, be a theist, and secondly be a Catholic. To think of it now, it is astounding just how much indoctrination actually goes into this process of being deitized.

Now I think I've stated in an earlier post that I don't really like the word atheism because for one, it often used pejoratively, as in "losing one's faith," and secondly, it doesn't really explain my "beliefs" or lack thereof beliefs in a manner that gives ample weight or contrast to those of believers. Now if deitized is used to mean acquiring faith in the existence of a god, or gods, be it monotheistic, polytheistic, or deistic, then undeitized would mean the unacquiring of these beliefs and a return to the position I had when I was born, which was none. I would much prefer the contrast to be deitized versus undeitized because it obviates the amelioration of the word "faith" and forces us to see it for what it really is: Indoctrination.

My name is Jimmy, and I have been undeitized :P

Well, I have to agree with you. When I tell people I am atheist, I almost feel like some take it as "used to be religious, but not anymore."

I know that is the case for some atheists, but most were just born HUMAN. Without religion or faith or any superstition, until it was cast upon them by parents and/or guardians.
I want to be human. I hate having to attached labels for society. I feel the same way about religion as I do about my sexuality. I am just ME. My non belief and sexual prefrence don't define me .
They don't validate or make choices for me.
My experience as an adult human being do.

Right on, SD! I just added this to the member quotes thread.  ;D

Aw, thank you, Amicale!! :D

:) I totally feel the same way. I'm just ME. If you spend some time with me in person, sure, you'll eventually find out that I'm both lesbian and atheist, but neither label defines who I am. Personally, first and foremost I'd consider myself a mom, a friend, a daughter and grand daughter, a total nerd, a bookworm, a cat lover, a music nut, a coffee addict, someone who's passionate about history and philosophy, etc etc... and really, that's prettymuch how I live my life. Outside of this forum, my atheism isn't discussed all that often, and anyone who knows me pretty well just takes it for granted that I'm never going to date a guy, so...  :D I don't even think about that too often. I'm just me.

Yes~
Nerds and coffee addicts unite. :D

Quote from: Sweetdeath on April 11, 2012, 06:53:25 PM
Yes~
Nerds and coffee addicts unite. :D

Dyslexics and velcro afficianados, untie!  ;D

(https://www.happyatheistforum.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmanolomen.com%2Fimages%2Funtied.shoelaces.jpg&hash=685cbe3742fcfe749bd05479473c89fe5c711a4e)

Quote from: Amicale on April 11, 2012, 03:30:42 AM

Quote from: lebrecht52 on April 11, 2012, 03:19:27 AM

Quote from: cgmccall on April 10, 2012, 08:33:30 PM
I've been an atheist all my life, but the topic of conversion to atheism has interested me for a while.
It didn't even occur to me until a few years ago that people unconvert from religion. It's not as though it seemed impossible, it just wasn't a line of thinking that I was really exposed to. You hear about people converting to new religions, but when people talk about atheism it's often just a standoff between two people on TV. They talk about ideas but not themselves so much. Atheist just kind of...are.
Then I told a group of fellow students that I was atheist, and one guy asked me "Oh, when did you lose your faith?"
I was surprised. Why would I need have it in the first place? And...that happens? I guess it must. How often does it happen?
That's a question I've had for a while (someone tell me if it's already been discussed here) What perscentage of Atheists have always been non-believers, and what percentage unconverted during thier lives?

Very interesting.  I always answer I have never lost faith, only have no religious superstitions. I have been an atheist since childhood.   About 70 years.
Anne

:)

One way of saying it that we seem to have recently adopted on the forum as being a neat idea is this: if you never had any religious beliefs, you would be a never-theist, whereas if you had religious beliefs but gave them up, you'd be an ex-theist. I like the distinction, because when you tell someone you're an atheist, they still don't quite know how you got to that position. Myself, I'm an ex-theist atheist.

May I ask, just for the sake of curiosity... when you were a teenager or a young adult, did you ever feel any inclination to explore religious beliefs? Or was it never of any interest to you?

I was never personally interested in religion, but my parents (both atheists) insisted that I learn the basics of what people believed, so I wouldn't be offensive by accident. Also, I studied world history for my Bachelors, and I love history, and religion permeates every part of history imaginable. Certainly, I've always been way too much a skeptic (a person who asks questions) to be interested in any idea that insists you not ask questions -- no religion for me.

I'm sure many of us would love to have atheists parents. ;__;

Quote from: Amicale on April 11, 2012, 06:38:01 PM
:) I totally feel the same way. I'm just ME. If you spend some time with me in person, sure, you'll eventually find out that I'm both lesbian and atheist, but neither label defines who I am. Personally, first and foremost I'd consider myself a mom, a friend, a daughter and grand daughter, a total nerd, a bookworm, a cat lover, a music nut, a coffee addict, someone who's passionate about history and philosophy, etc etc... and really, that's prettymuch how I live my life. Outside of this forum, my atheism isn't discussed all that often, and anyone who knows me pretty well just takes it for granted that I'm never going to date a guy, so...  :D I don't even think about that too often. I'm just me.

I agree Amicale (and SD)  I don't really talk or think about my atheism much outside of this forum, and it's definitely not a huge defining piece of my personality, except in comparison to really religious folks.  Like, a lot of the members of my family really think of "Christian" as something that defines them as people, and also somewhat something that defines us as a family.  Only I'm not, so when I stumble up against that kind of "group identity" of "Christian"; that sort of makes me feel like an outsider and makes me really feel my atheism more than usual.  But for the most part, I just kind of feel like it's a normal default setting, something that is a natural part of me that doesn't take a lot of thought and consideration, like having brown hair, or size 7 feet.  I'm not really An Atheist most of the time, I'm just Ali, who also happens to be an atheist.