Happy Atheist Forum

I thought it would be appropriate to start a thread where people can share their perspective on death, how to cope with the finality of death, and thoughts on dying.  These are issues that many atheists have to work through and having a place to read and discuss an often avoided topic should be helpful.

My perspective is fairly simply that I won't be around to worry about being dead after I am dead so there is no sense worrying about it now; especially since it is inevitable and it only makes sense to worry over that which we can change.  I also think that religion thrives as much as it does because people want to hear that there is an afterlife rather than dealing with a finite existence.

“Death does not concern us, because as long as we exist, death is not here. And when it does come, we no longer exist.”
- Epicurus

...that about sums it up. Anyway, it's not the death part that I think about; it's the dying part.

A 14 year old summed it up best for me: I don't fear death, it's the part right before that I'm scared of.

In a way, the knowledge of death makes us one of the weakest species.

We then start to deny the fact we will die, by, pretending we're going to live forever in heaven.

The understanding of death is simple, when we die, its over, No more existence.

And I can LIVE with that.

I sometimes am afraid of death but then I think to myself "I didn't exsist before I was born and I didn't mind so much then.". I think about death a lot more after having left religion. It makes me want to enjoy the moment, speak my mind, go after what I want,and let go of guilt and regret. I now understand that life is over in a flash. I am probably not going to get another shot at life so I had better start enjoying this one. That's part of the reason I feel religion is so criminal.

How do you get nothingness into perspective? It's hard to find the right angle.

My mother died a couple of years ago, she had Alzheimer's so I welcomed it, I'm sure she would have too.
I don't fear death, deterioration and disability are much more worrying.

I did have a friend who died, he had a young family and really embraced life, much more than I ever have.
I didn't have the wisdom or illusion to find anything but sadness in the situation.

I haven't really had much death around me.

I don't think i'm afraid of dying, rather, i'm afraid of dying early. I think 80 is a good age, as long as i'm not completely cenile by then. My grandfather is 83 and although his health is pretty bad, his brain is still top-notch. I want to pass peacefully, in my sleep, if possible.

I tend not to think about death too much, though.

I'm okay with death.  I'd prefer it to be quick, but lord knows the world ain't given me what I want so far, so I'll probably end up with a long slow cancer or something.  But as mentioned above, I didn't miss much before my birth, and I don't reckon I'll miss much after I've died.  I just need to do a better job filling the interim days.  For what it's worth.

I won't be aware of being dead so the condition is irrelevent.

Death is the inevitable result of life. The process of dieing is the b*tch here... It can be long and rather unpleasant.

"..a delightful morbid thread..." says the chameleon raising an eyebrow "... but I have thought about it and looked into it, how I want to be disposed of, and seeing as the possibility of my body lying under a shield on the deck of a Viking ship floating out to sea as archers fire torched arrows from the cliffs to set me ablaze on my journey to Valhalla is out of the question (I did enquire, however the local council objected, something about health & safety on canal highways)... I am going for a simpler approach then, at a burial field, by chance, not far from me, a simple ceremony where I will be buried under a tree, in a cardboard box. An Ash I think, no cold headstone or plaque for me, just Dad's Tree and if they wish, they can come and give it a hug, or sit beneath it for a while, as I feed it from below, so, perhaps then, in some way I will live for a hundred years more, before I fall once more, and then I hope I burn just as bright..."

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Quote from: "Jats"I will be buried under a tree, in a cardboard box. An Ash I think, no cold headstone or plaque for me, just Dad's Tree and if they wish, they can come and give it a hug, or sit beneath it for a while, as I feed it from below, so, perhaps then, in some way I will live for a hundred years more, before I fall once more, and then I hope I burn just as bright..."

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I was going to ask you about the tree you were going to be buried under, was it new or old.
But I started wondering does anyone grow their death tree beforehand, play Bach for it and discuss where god went wrong?
If I get to late 70s I'm going to get me a death tree, I want to know the tree who's gonna consume me.

Were it not for the burial laws here, when my time came I'd go to a little bluff south of San Simeon which is covered in sycamores [I think they're sycamores], sit down, and molder right there.

I'm curious about it. Do we just not exist anymore or do we have spirits that continue to exist in some way. I really want to find out, so I'm kind of looking forward to death. But in the mean time, I'm trying to find something interesting to do.

I'd like my corpse to be dunked into liquid nitrogen and smashed into a million pieces, and then a tree planted over it.

When I was first diagnosed, the possibility of death was very real to me and after looking it in the eye, I decided there was no reason to fear it.  As others have said, I didn't exist before I was born so it's not really a problem in not existing.  I did give careful consideration to the types of treatments I have received after surgery.  I turned down chemo because the chances of the chemo helping prevent recurrence were less than the chances of the side effects causing irreversible congestive heart failure.  I decided I rather risk dying of cancer than have an 11% chance slowly suffocating to death.  

Death is no big deal, but dying can be very tricky.

I have also discovered that, for me at least, it is impossible to believe for more than a week or two that I will actually die.  It has been three years since my surgery and I am back to being temporarily immortal.

Personally, Death scares the bejesus out of me.  Not so much the being dead part, thats easy, but rather the dying part.

Quote from: "Roganthis72"Personally, Death scares the bejesus out of me.  Not so much the being dead part, thats easy, but rather the dying part.

I've been through that part and, to be honest, I didn't really notice much. It was quick. Luckily, so were the paramedics.

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"Were it not for the burial laws here, when my time came I'd go to a little bluff south of San Simeon which is covered in sycamores [I think they're sycamores], sit down, and molder right there.

"...I like that, cept I don't like Sycamores though, bloody weeds, though pretty good for burning..." says Jats returning from felling and logging a few , a repost then...

QuoteI don't give a fuck

"...and that is as it should be, when you are young, little thought of tomorrow, meagre consequence of next, just now, living for today, and yes, I could have been much more secure, if as a consequence of staying in my own town with the school yard friends that I visit now and again who are stuck in their same routine, yet when I do, I know that I have seen things with these eyes that they would never believe, done things that they could not comprehend, for some of us have to burn brighter, even though it quickens the end, brings it closer, so, a different contentment for me then, for when it's time to die, perhaps, I am more ready then, no if only's, things left to try, but, still, not just yet awhile...things to do..."

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as long as i die in washington state i'm fine,

even if it's the day i return the plane crashes on the runway,

as long as it's in washington.

i refuse to die in wack ass florida.

i've been shot at out here, hit by a car, had a swollen left lung, but i refuse to die, until i'm in a suitable environment.

I heard a comedian once say he wants to die near a tree, be absorbed by the tree, have the tree cut down and made in to paper and then he wants the bible printed on him. I can't remember who it was but it made me chortle.

My view on dying is that I just hope the process of my death leaves little financial burden on those I'm survived by. I hope my death is painless for me. I hope I've left enough of an impression on enough people to be remembered once I'm gone. I want my funeral to be a party. I want to be cremated. I'd like to live as long as I can... as long as I'm relatively pain free. I'd like to have a long retirement.

I would love to be buried outside of a casket.  Or fed to the buzzards.  Something to give back the food I've taken from this planet.

Quote from: "TheWilliam"as long as i die in washington state i'm fine,

even if it's the day i return the plane crashes on the runway,

as long as it's in washington.

i refuse to die in wack ass florida.

i've been shot at out here, hit by a car, had a swollen left lung, but i refuse to die, until i'm in a suitable environment.

I ed,  Florida is like Guadalcanal, without the charm.

Quote from: "PoopShoot"Or fed to the buzzards.  

There are places that can do that legally in the U.S.  It's called a natural burial or something...I just know someone who knows someone who's land is used for it sometimes.

Yeah, I watched a video of one of these burials looong time ago when it was posted on Pharyngula.  It seems like a pretty awesome way to be disposed of.  I would hate to be the guy whose job it is to make sure the brain and marrow was accessible to the birds, though.  Real horrorshow.

Well, I don't think that's legal in Kentucky, though burial on private land is OK.  I'm not sure about caskets, but I think they're required.

I want the cheapest cremation possible.  I don't give a hoot on what if anything is done with my ashes.  The can sit on a shelf in the garage for all I care.  I would really prefer to be buried in a cotton shroud in the back yard but my family is too squeamish.

I am volunteering at our local Hospice House and I know that is the place where I intend to go through the process of dying.  The nurses really know what they are doing when it comes to pain management.  The place is like a well appointed private home where kids and pets are welcome.  There is lots of laughter along with tears.  The very best thing is that no one pushes religion on anyone.

Quote from: "PoopShoot"Well, I don't think that's legal in Kentucky, though burial on private land is OK.  I'm not sure about caskets, but I think they're required.

 I'm 99% sure the one I watched was allowed because it was native american in origin.  I wish I could find it.

I'm donating my body to science in the hope that I end up a High School science class skeleton and spend the next 25, 50, maybe 100 years after I'm dead being inappropriately posed by hormone crazed, smart ass kids.

Don't tell me they don't use donated bodies that way.  The dream will live on!

Quote from: "pinkocommie"I'm 99% sure the one I watched was allowed because it was native american in origin.  I wish I could find it.

Well if it was in your area it was probably also on sovereign land.

Quote from: "pinkocommie"

Quote from: "PoopShoot"Well, I don't think that's legal in Kentucky, though burial on private land is OK.  I'm not sure about caskets, but I think they're required.

 I'm 99% sure the one I watched was allowed because it was native american in origin.  I wish I could find it.

I'm donating my body to science in the hope that I end up a High School science class skeleton and spend the next 25, 50, maybe 100 years after I'm dead being inappropriately posed by hormone crazed, smart ass kids.

Don't tell me they don't use donated bodies that way.  The dream will live on!

Donate to a college, instead. I lived with a girl who was getting a doctoral degree in Physical Therapy. She brought home pieces of "her" skeleton all the time. We had a human skull as the center piece on our coffee table for about a month. We'd leave entire hands in the fridge, so when people came over we'd say, "Hey, can you snag me a beer?" Fun times. You can only imagine what they do in the lab. Eep.   But honestly, that "guy" was the life of the party for a good six months.

Quote from: "Whitney"

Quote from: "PoopShoot"Or fed to the buzzards.  

There are places that can do that legally in the U.S.  It's called a natural burial or something...I just know someone who knows someone who's land is used for it sometimes.

that sounds mega awesome. seems more like how it should be.

now my imagination is running i wouldn't mind if kids made toys out of my bones.

Quote from: "TheWilliam"now my imagination is running i wouldn't mind if kids made toys out of my bones.

When I was younger I had wanted my hands made into bookends and my skull hollowed out and converted to a candy dish.

Quote from: "PoopShoot"

Quote from: "TheWilliam"now my imagination is running i wouldn't mind if kids made toys out of my bones.

When I was younger I had wanted my hands made into bookends and my skull hollowed out and converted to a candy dish.

i would totally buy your skull off ebay and fill it with red, pink and yellow starbursts.

but it needs to be listed as "buy it now" i don't have the patience for auctions.

thank you.

Quote from: "TheWilliam"

Quote from: "PoopShoot"

Quote from: "TheWilliam"now my imagination is running i wouldn't mind if kids made toys out of my bones.

When I was younger I had wanted my hands made into bookends and my skull hollowed out and converted to a candy dish.

i would totally buy your skull off ebay and fill it with red, pink and yellow starbursts.

but it needs to be listed as "buy it now" i don't have the patience for auctions.

thank you.

That is deeply meaningful to me.  Thank you, kind sir.

there I go getting misty eyed

What are you plans for the reproductive organs? I just watched a doco on ed gein and I think I may have a business proposition for you!

i could actually use a new ballbag myself. not the contents, but just the bag.

color is not an issue, but no tattoos please.

"Must not all things at the last be swallowed up in death?" -Plato

I'd like to die like my gramps.
He was silently taken by death in his sleep.
Unlike the noisy passengers of the bus he was driving.

Quote from: "NothingSacred"What are you plans for the reproductive organs? I just watched a doco on ed gein and I think I may have a business proposition for you!

They all tell me I'm an asshat.  I suppose I could become one in death, too.

Quote from: "PoopShoot"

Quote from: "NothingSacred"What are you plans for the reproductive organs? I just watched a doco on ed gein and I think I may have a business proposition for you!

They all tell me I'm an asshat.  I suppose I could become one in death, too.

You know that could be a possibility so long as you arent hairy ...too much clean up

Quote from: "TheWilliam"i could actually use a new ballbag myself. not the contents, but just the bag.

color is not an issue, but no tattoos please.

If you find one let me know .My coin purse has a hole in it and im in the market for a new one. My husband wont let me use his...love stinks  

Quote from: "NothingSacred"

Quote from: "PoopShoot"

Quote from: "NothingSacred"What are you plans for the reproductive organs? I just watched a doco on ed gein and I think I may have a business proposition for you!

They all tell me I'm an asshat.  I suppose I could become one in death, too.

You know that could be a possibility so long as you arent hairy ...too much clean up

Just in the hole.  The rest is fairly bald.

Death really scares. The vision that someday  I will not exist FOREVER, terryfies me. I know that human beings should not fear the unknown, because the unknown doesn't always mean something terrible. But death isn't such a thing. We can't feel it, we can't see it, we can't stop it and we can't go back from her. I cant deal with death and the most sad thing is that I ca't make peace with that. I cant accept it,  so I run. Im trying to forget about death by doing things that absorbs my mind. And the fear always comes back. Sometimes Im afraid I will lose my mind

P.S.-Thank you Whitney for creating this topic

There.  Not there.  The whole thing is bizarre.

Hanabishi, I suggest that you think about death.  Sit down and think about it.  Pay attention to your feelings about death, not trying to change them but just observe them.  Think about change and impermanence.  Think about the child you used to be and the adult you are now.  Don't avoid thinking about death but as you do think about it also think about the yesterday that is gone and the tomorrow that has not come.  Think about now, this minute, this second which does not contain death.

Think about this second which contains life.  

Drink more water.  Eat your vegetables. Exercise.  Get your Vitamin D checked.

Hello HAFmembers,

Thans to Whitney for starting this thread. Good to be able to give my perspective in context.

Death is a fact.
One second I'm aware, the next I'm not.
It's a liberating thought that everything ends. If someone offered me perpetual existance, I'd kill myself.
It's a good thing death exists, death makes me enjoy life all the more...

As for organs... Harvest what may be needed. Bury the husk that remains.

Enjoy this friday  

Quote from: "chrisbellekom"Hello HAFmembers,

Thans to Whitney for starting this thread. Good to be able to give my perspective in context.

Death is a fact.
One second I'm aware, the next I'm not.
It's a liberating thought that everything ends. If someone offered me perpetual existance, I'd kill myself.
It's a good thing death exists, death makes me enjoy life all the more...

As for organs... Harvest what may be needed. Bury the husk that remains.

Enjoy this friday  

I agree with all of this except the burial part.  Do you actually care about being buried?

Quote from: "pinkocommie"Do you actually care about being buried?

Are you kidding me!?! Thats ALL I care about!!

I want a huge, over-sized tombstone that states all of the great things I did in my life.

I also want that stone to be crafted from a mix of pure silver and gold, and the text to be in black diamond.

 

Quote from: "tymygy"

Quote from: "pinkocommie"Do you actually care about being buried?

Are you kidding me!?! Thats ALL I care about!!

I want a huge, over-sized tombstone that states all of the great things I did in my life.

I also want that stone to be crafted from a mix of pure silver and gold, and the text to be in black diamond.

 

Haha, yes.  I would also like a pretty lady/handsome man crying over my grave 24/7 and for the song Don't You (Forget About Me) to play every time anyone comes within 25 feet of my burial plot.  Also, dancing monkeys.  My life really can't be properly memorialized without dancing monkeys.

Quote from: "tymygy"

Quote from: "pinkocommie"Do you actually care about being buried?

I want a huge, over-sized tombstone that states all of the great things I did in my life.
 

I like Spike Milligan's epitaph.

QuoteIt now bears the words "Duirt me leat go raibh me breoite", or "I told you I was ill"

Actually, truly realizing my mortality for the first time was an incredibly powerful and empowering moment for me.  I was getting raped and beaten and ordered around.  Then I came to the realization that the worst thing they could do was kill me and that they were probably going to kill me.  I'd seen their faces clearly so I felt there was no way I'd get out of the situation alive.  So I started really fighting, bashing my head back into the one guy's face, not caring if the guy with a gun shot me or not.  I was able to own myself again.  Their power over me was the ability to kill me and once I no longer cared if they killed me they lost power over my mind.  Power over my body was another matter.

They must have been interrupted.  That was what the cops thought anyway.  I have no recollection.  I'm not saying I'm happy it happened, I'm permanently somewhat fucked up from it.  However, I learned something from it; the worst thing that can happen is that I can die and that's going to happen anyway.  So I can own my life and be who I want no matter how risky some things my sense of self requires.  And I try not to do anything I can't live with.  Knowing that dying is an option makes living a lot easier.

A piece of tooth broke off a little while ago. I was eating some Ben and Jerry's Americone Dream and bit down on something hard, which turned out to be a piece of my tooth.

I'm getting old I guess, breaking teeth for goddness sake. Fifty-seven isn't that old but next year I'll be fifty-eight and I know I'll be getting there sure enough and not all that long from now, getting to where it's real close to the end.

But it's the getting old part that frightens me, not the dying part. I'm going to have to go see a dentist about that broken tooth and for me going to the dentist is much worse than dying.

Quote from: "pinkocommie"

Quote from: "chrisbellekom"Hello HAFmembers,

Thans to Whitney for starting this thread. Good to be able to give my perspective in context.

Death is a fact.
One second I'm aware, the next I'm not.
It's a liberating thought that everything ends. If someone offered me perpetual existance, I'd kill myself.
It's a good thing death exists, death makes me enjoy life all the more...

As for organs... Harvest what may be needed. Bury the husk that remains.

Enjoy this friday  :-)

Quote from: "chrisbellekom"Actually, yes... I like the idea of slowly desolving back into the eart. It's even more environmentally friendly

This assumes no casket (or a plain pine box).  As nice as the idea is, burial in this case should be under the stipulation that the deceased be buried in a compostable device.

Quote from: "PoopShoot"

Quote from: "chrisbellekom"Actually, yes... I like the idea of slowly desolving back into the eart. It's even more environmentally friendly :D

In a cloud of toxic fumes and poisoning at least two independent water sources while at it  

Quote from: "TheWilliam"i refuse to die in wack ass florida.

Agreed.

As far as "for when I die".. I like the tree idea, but it got me thinking.. I want to made into a puppet, have someone in a tree control it, and just scare random people.
If not.. Eh, I'll let others do what they want.

As far as fearing, or caring.. I do neither. I'm here one day, gone the next. I like the quote from The Bucket List: "If I'm wrong, I win."

I fear death now that I have two kids. I don't want to die until they are at least well into adulthood. The idea of missing their lives bothers me more than anything ever has.

Other than that I find it hard to fear a state of being that you cannot actually experience. Death is the release from dying so the prolonged dying or deterioration seems to be what should actually be feared. Thankfully I am young now and by the time I am old and decrepit I am sure forty to fifty years from now there will be legislation passed in this state that allows me to bypass dying and get on with death.

I have no doubt in my mind that there is no afterlife. I wonder though how someone that believe in an afterlife can find comfort in the fact that they will never die. I guess all we can do is exist so if I had the choice to exist or not exist then I would rather exist. But for eternity? Seems a little mad.

If I am to die, I at least want to do it in an interesting, awesome, humourous, or memorable way.

It pleases me to no end to think that someday, someone will mention my death. I don't really care if they know my name, they could come across a blurb in some futuristic data terminal while reasearching history and say: "Hey, check this out. Some asshole died-" It doesn't really matter how that sentence ends really.

If I was dying, from something painful and swift, like say from "mexican jumping cancer" or whatever then I'd go out and do absolutely retarded stuff. Like fight in a war weilding nothing but a shovel and a slingshot, walk up to a mob boss and give him a noogie, or test something ludacrousy dangerous like time travel, teleportation, live genetic reengineering, or becoming a super cyborg.

Also, I should mention that there are plenty of afterlifes that are not eternal. Reincarnation, for one, comes to mind.

I want my ashes scattered under this lovely old Loblolly Pine tree in my back yard.  It's about 90 ft tall and oddly shaped from ice storms.  A young pine is growing at the drip line of its "mother".  The sapling is about 5ft. tall.  I hope my ashes have the right nutrient mix for the trees.  If no fool cuts it down it could live for about 250 years.  I figure it has about 200 years to go.

Most obvious prospective:
When your dead...your dead.  The end.
Anything else invites some form of religion.

Quote from: "SomewhereInND"Most obvious prospective:
When your dead...your dead.  The end.
Anything else invites some form of religion.

Unless one is not dead, but then not resurrected in any way currently not discovered. One can no more deny the minute possibility of life after death than one can not prove a negative. But to all intents and purposes I agree with you, once the brain is no longer functioning and is beyond recall, that's it!

Like a lot of posters here, I'm not afraid of being dead, but dying slowly in some painful manner. Death is the inevitable, natural end to living and is not something to be afraid of. It is the only thing that I, as human beings, am guaranteed: once born, I will die. There is no escaping it, despite the many theists who want to persuade me to believe otherwise.

Oddly enough, I'm reminded of a Bible verse, 1 Corinthians 13:11:

QuoteWhen I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. - NIV

For me "putting the ways of childhood behind me" means accepting and welcoming the inevitable end. No supernatural intervention will save me.

In a way, I'm looking forward to my death. Life has been a heavy burden from which death will release me. I have considered suicide, but I have a wife who loves me and needs me. There are only two other people left in the world that I love; my mom and my brother and if I survive all three of them I hope I will have the guts to punch my own ticket.

In a way, the thought of dying comforts me. I don't believe in an afterlife, so when I'm dead, that's the end for me. I spend a lot of time wishing I were dead anyway, mostly when I'm working.

My will stipulates that I be cremated. But at that point, everything that I was will be gone and I'll be past caring about what happens to my remains; they could be flushed down a toilet for all I care. And I find that very comforting.  

I had a very close cousin who killed himself (after he became an atheist). He had a 20yr long battle w/ bipolar disorder w/ severe depression that left him nearly bedridden, he never responded well to treatments & had basically lost everything (he was mid 40s); his wife, his career, his beloved 2-seater airplane, his pilot's license & his dignity. While I never discussed it w/ him, I contend that it was only after gaining an atheistic, liberating view of death that he was able to finally end his lifetime of suffering. He methodically planned his death for 6mos prior to a date he had circled on the calendar w/a smiley face, April 23 (we found his detailed plans/notes on his computer). He was able to get his affairs in order, write letters to family & friends, say his goodbyes (unbeknownst to us), find a home for his beloved cat, right down to writing apology notes to EMS, Fire, Police (he was sorry they had to see the gore & drama or that it would disturb or inconvenience them) that he nailed to the tree above his body w/info on who they should contact (he used a shotgun). His writings conveyed a sense of relief. He knew that oblivion would end his pain & he need not worry about a god or eternal punishment, just sweet nothingness.

Not trying to romanticize suicide, his or anyone's, but I clearly get it. His was a terminal cancer of the mind, he had every right to say "enough!" I detest the judgements survivors make that he "took the easy way out" or he was "only thinking of himself". Nonsense. We don't have the right to expect someone to endure unrelenting, unbearable pain for the sake of our own comfort or tears. For some, suicide *is* often a snap decision before even seeking help, that's truly tragic & maybe that's selfish, idk; but for many that's NOT the case. Either way, it's their choice. Of course survivors will grieve, as we did. But mostly I'm glad he's resting in peace...er, oblivion. But, the xtians in my family said he did it because he "hated god", was "spiritually & morally empty" & had nothing to live after turning his back on god (as if jaysus had offered him so much peace, hope or relief as a believer, ever).   :upset:

Quote from: "aerie"I detest the judgements survivors make that he "took the easy way out" or he was "only thinking of himself". Nonsense.

:raised:

Quote from: "Asmodean"

Quote from: "aerie"I detest the judgements survivors make that he "took the easy way out" or he was "only thinking of himself". Nonsense.

:raised:

I agree. I remember reading a column by Dan Savage, a gay sex advice columnist. He basically said the idea that "God never gives us more than we can handle" is utter bullshit. His reasoning was that people kill themselves every day because life dumps more on them than they can handle.

Quote from: "Whitney"I thought it would be appropriate to start a thread where people can share their perspective on death, how to cope with the finality of death, and thoughts on dying.  These are issues that many atheists have to work through....

I have no fear of death, but must confess that from the time I became an atheist (or earlier) and up till age 21 I believed in the existence of an afterlife.  I think that may have been a way of coping, or it may have been a hold-over from my religious days, or it may have been a simple interest in things mysterious.

Quote from: "Whitney"My perspective is fairly simply that I won't be around to worry about being dead after I am dead so there is no sense worrying about it now...

I have talked with atheists who acknowledged experiencing a fear of Hell.  What if, after all, they were mistaken?  It's one thing to toss belief in God aside, but there is that nagging fear of Hell, that for some, won't quite go away.  I experienced that trepidation myself till age 16, no longer, but for some that fear persists.

Quote from: "Whitney"I also think that religion thrives as much as it does because people want to hear that there is an afterlife rather than dealing with a finite existence.

You may well be right; but religion also seems to give people's lives meaning.  The religious often stress that atheists' lives are without purpose.  Do they mean without immortality?

Quote from: "Tank"I won't be aware of being dead so the condition is irrelevent.

It's the getting there that's the concern.

Quote from: "Cycel"

Quote from: "Tank"I won't be aware of being dead so the condition is irrelevent.

It's the getting there that's the concern.

Of course, that has always been the problem.  

Quote from: "Tank"Of course, that has always been the problem.  :D I believe that stuff blows up pretty fast. A quick way to go, yes?  

Yeah, I always figured an airplane crash would be a good way to go, and the worst to my mind has got to be a toss-up between burning and drowning.

The best way to go would be any way that was painless.  The worst way to go would be congestive heart failure which is nothing but a slow form of suffocation.  I turned down chemo because the one the doctors would have used had a side effect which was an 11% chance of irreversible congestive heart failure.  Nasty stuff.

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"Yeah, I always figured an airplane crash would be a good way to go, and the worst to my mind has got to be a toss-up between burning and drowning.

So crashing into the sea in a burning aircraft would be sort of a half way ideal then?

Another good way to go would be a narcotics overdose; floating away in a beautiful dream.

I tell my wife I want to go by being shot by a jealous husband, but oddly enough, she doesn't seem to think that is funny.  

My perspective on death is fairly straight foward. Once my brain/biochemistry structure is sufficiently degraded that I am no longer recognisable as me by those who are closest to me I am dead, even if my body is still walking and talking.

I do not believe that I have a soul because there is no reason to believe that my conciouness arises from outside my body. With so many people suffering from mental health problems as a result of degredation or damage to their brain I think that we can be fairly certain that our conciousness arises from the brain and the chemical environment in which it exists.

Quote from: "Tank"

Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"Yeah, I always figured an airplane crash would be a good way to go, and the worst to my mind has got to be a toss-up between burning and drowning.

So crashing into the sea in a burning aircraft would be sort of a half way ideal then?

Looks like I'm getting the shit-end of the stick there, either way.

I've actually thought about this quite a bit and have come to a conclusion that puts me at ease. I believe death brings oblivion and that one cannot care about being dead in death so why fear it? It's a sort of release.

One cannot experience everything life has to offer in one lifetime, this is fact. There are just to many things that can be done and most don't have the resources to try everything. Questioning death always brings the whole "Purpose to life" question up for me, what I mean is, if death is a release and life is full of shit than what is the point? Well, there are the good parts and the bad parts. I believe the whole point is to avoid the crappy parts and strive for the good ones.

What are the good parts some people ask? Well I think that is up to the individual. For me it's knowledge, I learn small bits and pieces wherever I can find them no matter how trivial. New thoughts, new ideas whatever peeks my interest at any given point. I find myself watching shows like 'How it's made.' on the science channel not because I may find some use for it some day but just because it's there.

I find life and all it's small bits fascinating and my only regret, if I were ever to have any in my moment of death, is not being able to experience everything.

QuoteIt's a liberating thought that everything ends. If someone offered me perpetual existance, I'd kill myself.

I'd accept it if I could end it at any given moment. More time to experience and learn new things? I would welcome it.

I suppose one could ask what the point was if everything were to be lost or forgotten. That would lead to there being no point at all. Maybe the point is just to enjoy it? Then why not enjoy as much as you can?

To some degree I don't fear death. But if I were in a life threatening situation then I know I would be fearful. I want to live. Life is precious and is worth living for.
I do fear the death of my wife or children. I don't know how I would cope if one of them died.
I hope I die before any of them, but hopefully that is a long time from now.

Would I have regrets before I died? Certainly not with regards to not having done certain life activities e.g. skydiving, scuba diving etc. I mean, when you are dying these things likely don't matter. They are fun things to pass the time while you are around but ultimately of no importance.
I might regret things like not telling my wife I love her often enough, or not being the best parent for my children. But then again I am trying to be the best I can in that regard so hopefully I will have nothing to regret. Who knows what the future holds?

Quote from: "tunghaichuan"Another good way to go would be a narcotics overdose; floating away in a beautiful dream.

Definitely an excellent way to go. Before the nausea and vomiting sets in of course.

Carlos Castaneda once said, “Only the idea of death makes a warrior sufficiently detached so that he is capable of abandoning himself to anything. He knows his death is stalking him and won’t give him time to cling to anything so he tries, without craving, all of everything.”

That makes sense to me.  In the face of death, we can only live.  As for quantity, we can try and perhaps succeed to add some days to our lives by prudence, a youthful spirit, and serious exercise - but there is another way to add quantity, which is to add, instead of duration, density.  We can make our days dense with life.

Hmm... I have to say that it occurs to me... that if we are to live life from an atheistic perspective, the entire validation of life is negated. Think about it: the common street trash and the famous billionaire both meet the same end; afterwards they won't care how much they thrived or how much they suffered, because it will be no more. The same goes for the rational and irrational, the ones who love religion and the ones who fight against it; in the face of eternal nothingness, everything is made totally pointless.

True, you can say "oh, well, but we'll be remembered", but no you won't. Once your relatives are dead, not even the memory of you will continue on; you'll be less than nothing... no emotions, no thoughts, no memories; a non-existence which many consider worse than hell. Even if you became a hero and went down in history, eventually all the records would pass away, whether in a couple thousand years or a couple million. You can say "we'll just enjoy life in the moment"; fair enough. There's not much else you can do is there? You may as well have a little cheer before the end inevitably comes, which it will. That's your fate, one and all; you can accept that fact, or you can shrink away from it and try and cling to some vain "meaning", but either way it doesn't really matter. If we're to be strictly logical, then everything, love, hate, joy, anger... it all amounts to absolutely nothing in the end.

Quote from: "Goathead"it all amounts to absolutely nothing in the end.

Indeed. So live while you can and get as much out of it as you can. because when the ride is over, that's it.

Enjoy the ban.