Your kids in a godless world

[Siz]

Something in another thread prompted me to ask a wider audience about this. I wondered if any of you are in relationships with theists (however inactive). And if you have kids, how do you share their spiritual education.

I'll give you my starter for 10...

My wife is a church goer (C of E) and was adamant that she wanted our 2 kids christened. That was fine with me as I know it can help Xtians in later life if they choose to take that path (I'm all for free will as long as it doesn't affect me). I, however, played no part in the ceremony (much to the chargrin of the vicar). The kids are now in an excellent C of E school, courtesy of the church (cheers for that!).

It is slightly awkward knowing that the kids are routinely brainwashed (we all know the drill), and they sometimes come home with Q's about the bible or other religious matters. I enjoy engaging them on this level as it gives me the chance to offer a more balanced view. I do my best be be genuinely impartial, with statements like '...some people think that...', or 'it could also be seen this way:...', or 'maybe that was just a story to illustrate a point'. I am normally able to field any queries without directly contradicting the school. I have never had to answer the killer question though, "What do you believe, Daddy?"...yet. But this is not far off. The older I (or they??) get the harder it seems for me to hold my tongue. Maybe I'll start introducing more searching responses and request rationales for any voiced conclusions. I'm pretty confident that with some gentle encouragement they will draw their own sensible conclusions without me jarring God out from under them at a later date.

Do you think I'm being fair to myself / my wife / my kids?

I wonder how you've dealt with (or are dealing with) this....

[Sweetdeath]

I honestly think it's sad to raise kids religiously.  Hopefully they will grow out of the invisible friend stage.  I've noted from many other members here, that interacting with non religion school kids (AKA the real world) helps open people up to the truth.

I think you should just be honest with them and treat god and the bible like greek, or norse, or any other mythology.

[Asmodean]

I agree with death. But then again, I don't have kids, so what do I know...

Well, one thing, actually: according to today's paper, researchers found that people don't get happier from having kids. Must be all the ruined carpets followed by drugs, unprotected sex and expensive habits...  ???

[The Magic Pudding]

Do you think I'm being fair to myself / my wife / my kids?

I wonder how you've dealt with (or are dealing with) this....

Ye I think jarring god out of them later sounds OK.
Death and Asmo, though I love them both conditionaly... they're giving parental advice?

[Sweetdeath]

Haha, I hate children so much. Though I am surprisingly okay at parenting advice/opinions.

[Stevil]

I would not be happy if my children wereto be sent to a religious based school. I see it as brainwashing. My kids ought to be exposed to a variety of ideas, they ought to be able to consiously choose.

Christenning/Baptism can happen later in life. It does not need to be forced onto a child or infant. Let them decide later in life. There is no hurry.

If they are being taught Christian views then I think the same amount of effort should be put into teaching them Atheist, Muslim, Buddism, Greek, Norse, Jewish, Maori, Aborigoni etc. Send them to a Muslim summer camp, or a Hindi Camp. Let them see other beliefs, let them make informed decisions as to their beliefs.
Read them the God Delusion book.

At the moment they seem to be getting taught only Christian. Children are such trusting, impressionable things. You are brainwashing them and taking choice away from them.

[Stevil]

I understand you are in quite a dilema, the family dynamic can be a difficult and challenging aspect of life. Your partner's desire to send the kids to Christian school and baptism is not for the kid's benefit. It is a selfish desire of your partner's.

To love, means to be supportive, understanding and accepting, not for force one's views onto another.
As a parent it is your responsibility to support your children, not to brainwash them, but to provide them opportunity, to give them life tools so that they can eventually be independant and make their own informed decisions.

[Siz]

Thanks for your respective advices... for all it's experiential baselessness.

It should indeed be a choice. But I want them to know what they are choosing between, and have the opportunity to make a decision on their own terms - not mine. I have no problem if people want to 'believe'. Ignorance is bliss for some. As long as it doesn't impinge my own journey.

I think when Father Christmas loses his magic is the time to dispel the god delusion... Unless I'm asked the direct question beforehand, at which point I shall pull the plug.

[fyv0h]

Kids aren't mentally developed enough to know where they stand on religion, unfortunately they can't escape the global reach of the church. If the kids must go to church, it's best to give them knowledge of other religions as well, so that they can begin building the reasoning necessary to make an informed decision regarding which faith (or hopefully lack thereof) they will ultimately follow.

[Sweetdeath]

Kids aren't mentally developed enough to know where they stand on religion, unfortunately they can't escape the global reach of the church. If the kids must go to church, it's best to give them knowledge of other religions as well, so that they can begin building the reasoning necessary to make an informed decision regarding which faith (or hopefully lack thereof) they will ultimately follow.

No one forces a child(ren) to go to church except the parents.
A child is born without religious supetstition. It's the parents that forcefully instill it. I find that very sad.

[fyv0h]

Kids aren't mentally developed enough to know where they stand on religion, unfortunately they can't escape the global reach of the church. If the kids must go to church, it's best to give them knowledge of other religions as well, so that they can begin building the reasoning necessary to make an informed decision regarding which faith (or hopefully lack thereof) they will ultimately follow.

No one forces a child(ren) to go to church except the parents.
A child is born without religious supetstition. It's the parents that forcefully instill it. I find that very sad.

Interesting, isn't it? An atheist baby garners "oohs" and "ahhs." People are smitten by the adorable adorableness of an adorable baby that knows no God. But if we walk in with the same religious mindset and slightly more developed vocabulary, we're filthy heathens.

[DeterminedJuliet]

As a parent of a very small child, I just wouldn't be able to do it. I was raised Catholic, and I was worried that not having my son Baptized was going to cause some controversy within the family (especially since we were married in a Catholic church), but it didn't. He's over a year old now, and no one's even mentioned it yet, thankfully.

I just wouldn't be able to send him to any kind of institutionalized religious "teaching" environment. Both my husband and I went through that when we were kids, and I just wouldn't be able to do it to my son. You have to consider that the church doesn't think that their role is to teach your child their "options", it's to teach them the "truth".

I'm glad that you are open-minded and seem very reasonable, but when it comes to small children, they really don't get a say in what they believe. They learn what they are explicitly told. They are most likely going to be told, in very clear terms, that the christian viewpoint is the correct viewpoint. If you are comfortable with that, then I say let it be, if you aren't, I'd say you should have an honest conversation with your partner about what you both want for your children.

[Siz]

As a parent of a very small child, I just wouldn't be able to do it. I was raised Catholic, and I was worried that not having my son Baptized was going to cause some controversy within the family (especially since we were married in a Catholic church), but it didn't. He's over a year old now, and no one's even mentioned it yet, thankfully.

I just wouldn't be able to send him to any kind of institutionalized religious "teaching" environment. Both my husband and I went through that when we were kids, and I just wouldn't be able to do it to my son. You have to consider that the church doesn't think that their role is to teach your child their "options", it's to teach them the "truth".

I'm glad that you are open-minded and seem very reasonable, but when it comes to small children, they really don't get a say in what they believe. They learn what they are explicitly told. They are most likely going to be told, in very clear terms, that the christian viewpoint is the correct viewpoint. If you are comfortable with that, then I say let it be, if you aren't, I'd say you should have an honest conversation with your partner about what you both want for your children.

It sounds like a lot of you guys had a pretty rotten time in your religious education. It's a story I've heard many times. Mine is not so fraught with misery. In fact my memories of the gentle religiousness of my (state) junior school are happy ones. And it appears that my children's school follows a similar pattern. Although it is known as a C of E school, it is a state school partially funded by the church. Only 50% of places are given to church goers, the rest are regular state applicants from many and varied religions. They certainly don't ram it down your throat. Actually, they have a decent handle on religions of the world with some surprisingly enlightened R.E - much broader than mine ever was.

I'm happy to let this be as I value the happy time I had learning Christianity and would like my children to benefit from it too. I am monitoring though to keep it 'real'. Like I've said before, once Father Christmas and the tooth fairy loose their magic its time to pull the plug on Jesus too.

[Sweetdeath]

How exactly does christianity benefit children? o_o

[Will]

I have to imagine such a thing is incredibly complicated and at times difficult. On the one hand, you clearly respect your SO's beliefs because you're with him/her, but at the same time you have your own beliefs that are directly contradictory to his/hers and I'm sure you're compelled to help your children remain objective enough to make what we all agree is the healthier decision when they're ready.

One thing I think that would be helpful is, when they're old enough, getting them online and allowing them to experience the really cool way a lot of the internet has become a crucible for the truth, burning away fallacies and lies, leaving only the truth. I'm sure a lot of people on this forum were really helped by the no-bullshit kind of interactions on the internet, myself included. As time goes on, and my generation and younger generations that grew up with the internet become adults and take over society, religion will have a smaller and smaller place in our lives. I'm thankful for that.