Violence in Religion

[Heathen's Guide]

I was having the same-old terrorist discussion with some Muslims a while back, and one of them made a point that I thought was a good one. I'm paraphrasing, but he basically said:

"I grew up around these these idiots.  You know who they are?  They're the ones who couldn't get woman if their life depended on it.  They're the rejects that no one wanted to talk to in high school.  As they get older, some of them get convinced that Allah makes them important when nothing else does, so they start wearing the white cotton [Muslim garb] so everyone will have to respect them because they're so religious.  You get the same thing in North America.  What kind of impression do you figure the world would have of America if we only filmed the whack jobs that live in communes and arm themselves "For Jesus and the imminent Battle of Armageddon"?  Most Americans see these guys as weird and way too close to violence.  That's how most Muslims see these terrorists."

Seeing the arrest of the militia group in who wanted to kill police, I kinda wonder how accurate this guy was...

[Ellainix]

Ignoring the violence part, I've seen some of that in the Christians.

[elliebean]

Ignoring the violence part, I've seen some of that in the Christians.

I thought the violence part was implied by the use of the term "terrorist".

[dogsmycopilot]

I was having the same-old terrorist discussion with some Muslims a while back, and one of them made a point that I thought was a good one. I'm paraphrasing, but he basically said:

"I grew up around these these idiots.  You know who they are?  They're the ones who couldn't get woman if their life depended on it.  They're the rejects that no one wanted to talk to in high school.  As they get older, some of them get convinced that Allah makes them important when nothing else does, so they start wearing the white cotton [Muslim garb] so everyone will have to respect them because they're so religious.  You get the same thing in North America.  What kind of impression do you figure the world would have of America if we only filmed the whack jobs that live in communes and arm themselves "For Jesus and the imminent Battle of Armageddon"?  Most Americans see these guys as weird and way too close to violence.  That's how most Muslims see these terrorists."

Seeing the arrest of the militia group in who wanted to kill police, I kinda wonder how accurate this guy was...

These are separate questions to me. There will be violence even without religion. But the so called moderate muslims do not speak out against the rest. I have only their book to go by and their book says we non believers are the enemy. So you can compare all you want but they are my enemy by their own declaration. It is different. Maybe not here in Mississippi which I would place on par with West Africa in terms of superstition level, but in the rest of the world it is different. No Cof E- er is going to tell me I'm the enemy because I don't go to church.

[Heathen's Guide]

Agree whole heatedly.  Only caveat is that I think a lot of Muslims see the BS for what it is.  Many I know are only Muslim as an accident of birth.

I was having the same-old terrorist discussion with some Muslims a while back, and one of them made a point that I thought was a good one. I'm paraphrasing, but he basically said:

"I grew up around these these idiots.  You know who they are?  They're the ones who couldn't get woman if their life depended on it.  They're the rejects that no one wanted to talk to in high school.  As they get older, some of them get convinced that Allah makes them important when nothing else does, so they start wearing the white cotton [Muslim garb] so everyone will have to respect them because they're so religious.  You get the same thing in North America.  What kind of impression do you figure the world would have of America if we only filmed the whack jobs that live in communes and arm themselves "For Jesus and the imminent Battle of Armageddon"?  Most Americans see these guys as weird and way too close to violence.  That's how most Muslims see these terrorists."

Seeing the arrest of the militia group in who wanted to kill police, I kinda wonder how accurate this guy was...

These are separate questions to me. There will be violence even without religion. But the so called moderate muslims do not speak out against the rest. I have only their book to go by and their book says we non believers are the enemy. So you can compare all you want but they are my enemy by their own declaration. It is different. Maybe not here in Mississippi which I would place on par with West Africa in terms of superstition level, but in the rest of the world it is different. No Cof E- er is going to tell me I'm the enemy because I don't go to church.

[karadan]

I used to live in Brunei which is a strict islamic country. However, they've never had a terrorist attack and they've never harboured terrorists. I think the main reason for this is because it is an affluent country with strong principles of education and community. Every Malay i ever met lived in a happy, two-car family with a strong sense of right and wrong. I remember lots of smiley people when living there. Generally, a happy nation has no terrorism. Correct me if I'm wrong but no terrorists have ever come from Iceland, Norway, Sweden or Finland - the four countries consistently at the top of the United Nation's human development index. I'm pretty sure you'll find a strong correlation between that index and the instances of home-grown terrorism as you go further down the scale.

Radicalisation seems to stem from areas where poverty, low instances of literacy, education and political instability prevail, no matter what part of the world, religion or theocracy they belong to. Some religions have followers who seem to justify acts of atrocity more easily than others but only because various tenets of their holy books specify aspects of religiously motivated violence in stronger or different terms. It is how the people interpret those books which is crucial. A happy person will be less inclined to interpret a bible verse in a negative way leading them to believe it is justifiable to kill someone because of possible differing beliefs. I think the main exception to this is when communities become so entrenched within theocratic order that children start to become wholesale radicalised before they're able to develop their own sense of morality. There's over a billion muslims in the world. Compared to this number, the amount of muslim motivated terrorist acts is many orders of magnitude smaller.

I despise fundamentalism in all its forms and I'm quite happy to speak for the majority of UK muslims by saying they feel the same way too.

[dogsmycopilot]

Many I know are only Muslim as an accident of birth.

If you think about it though that only makes them from a muslim family. Islam is not a race, it's a religion. Either you are religious or you are not. You can't be a little muslim any more than you can be a little pregnant. ! I think this is part of the problem with it. People want to act like it's a race, something they are born into- but it's not at all. I think people on both sides need to understand that so neither side causes offense. I see a lot of the BNP style commentary on places like you tube, even the anti-muslim crowd seems duped into treating it like a race. Tsk, tsk.

[Heathen's Guide]

It's because there are so many countries where you are automatically Muslim if you are born there.  If you live in Saudi Arabia for instance, you ARE Muslim by law.  This is also how they manage to say that Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world.  They just take the numbers from a census, see an increase, and are able to say how the faith is getting bigger.

It's BS, but that's what they do.

Many I know are only Muslim as an accident of birth.

If you think about it though that only makes them from a muslim family. Islam is not a race, it's a religion. Either you are religious or you are not. You can't be a little muslim any more than you can be a little pregnant. ! I think this is part of the problem with it. People want to act like it's a race, something they are born into- but it's not at all. I think people on both sides need to understand that so neither side causes offense. I see a lot of the BNP style commentary on places like you tube, even the anti-muslim crowd seems duped into treating it like a race. Tsk, tsk.